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Author Topic: Movies  (Read 53119 times)
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TrojanHorse
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« Reply #660 on: June 23, 2007, 02:20:23 PM »

J

I'll watch it again and report back to you.  I think the very fact that so many people were going gaga over it is precisely why it was so dissappointing to me - and "again" very much like disco. Bob & Carol & Ted & Alice was similarly celebrated a few years earlier and although it too is probably "not my thing" I would probaly call it a better movie than Shampoo.  I actually like Warren Beatty when he doesn't take himself so seriously. IMHO, he's not nearly smart enough to continue posing as an intellectual and I find it mildly offensive when he does (but this is probably an emotional reaction on my part)

And although you may share the popular belief that the disco era was ushered in by Saturday Night Fever, a few years later, I would argue that this is when the masses were finally clued into what was happening over the past several years in the clubs.  "Disco" music was alive and well in 1975.

I was an AOR jock in the 70s and our format was replaced by "disco" in the late 70s so I have particular disdain --though intellectually I know I should not.   Everyone is allowed to like whatever they want and it is no one's fault if they are ahead or behind the "curve" in any one area of life.  We are all focused in different areas at any given time...
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jbottle
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« Reply #661 on: June 23, 2007, 02:31:39 PM »

But the thing about "Shampoo" is it's detatched sociological view of the folly of the people in the film, not that we don't like Beatty, it's ultimately pretty flat about free love and all that silliness, and at some point you realize that for all his affected hipness, he's really just a calculating capitalist who, like his lover, looks to Jack Warden for dough.  What "Shampoo" is most definitely not is period piffle, because it knows exactly what it's doing in the way that "Boogie Nights" does withought the benefit of hindsight, it really catches a sadness that's hard to describe if you give it a chance.
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jbottle
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« Reply #662 on: June 23, 2007, 02:33:29 PM »

Oh, and B & C & T & A is average and so is "Carnal Knowledge."
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TrojanHorse
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« Reply #663 on: June 23, 2007, 02:37:54 PM »

Very nicely spoken Madupont

I'll have to watch that one again also.

My recollection of Bud Cort was not so much that he was genuinely depressed, but that he was overpriveldged, bored and looking for attention -- example: the carefully orchestrated "fake" hanging of himself.

Ruth Gordon represented a door opening to a different side of life that he had not considered.  She was the perfect enigma -- a youthful outlook on life from someone near the end of their journey...
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TrojanHorse
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« Reply #664 on: June 23, 2007, 02:50:43 PM »

The Last Waltz on the other hand I thought was quite good...   though it's been many many years and on my own argument perhaps I should not have...


I'll have to check them all out again and reassess...

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TrojanHorse
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« Reply #665 on: June 23, 2007, 02:53:10 PM »

...errrr... The Last Tango that is...

I was reading something in popular music about The Band, and I still have that rolling around in my head...
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jbottle
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« Reply #666 on: June 23, 2007, 03:32:17 PM »

"The Last Tango in Paris" is an overrated bore.

Looks like 1408 is going to do a respectable 18 or so but given the EV. AL. budget, the 11M Friday looks like a 28M weekend and a collossal bomb.

I think they needed a $65M weekend to recoup costs within 2 yrs.  Limping to $100M over several weeks isn't going to do it.....
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TrojanHorse
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« Reply #667 on: June 23, 2007, 04:08:22 PM »

"The Last Tango in Paris" is an overrated bore.


Hence, why I ackowledged that by my own earlier comment I suppose I should not have liked that movie, yet I do recall liking it and finding it much more interesting than SHampoo.   Frankly I didn't pay all that much attention to any of those movies.  I just recall Shampoo getting a LOT of attention and acclaim and thinking it was no big deal at all.

J,  just so I can put you in perspective, what was your feeling on Apocalypse Now,   avoiding the obvious Conrad comparisons.
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TrojanHorse
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« Reply #668 on: June 23, 2007, 04:15:13 PM »


Looks like 1408 is going to do a respectable 18 or so

It's funny that sometimes we like or dislike a movie because it did or didn't do well ... or because it was or wasn't critically acclaimed and have no problem reconciling all the irreconcilable positions we take.  Sometimes we choose to go along and sometimes we choose to be the contrarian...

I think in the end so much of whether we choose to like or dislike a movie is where we are in life and even the mood we are in at the time that we see the movie...
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jbottle
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« Reply #669 on: June 23, 2007, 04:22:40 PM »

Uh, "Apocalypse Now" is a masterpiece and an epic production, and "Last Tango..." is a fat old guy muttering about existential malaise while banging this hot young chick.

"Apocalypse Now" is about Martin Sheen being assigned to terminate with extreme prejudice an old fat guy muttering about existential malaise because he has "gone native" and has no "method" to his madness at all.

In "Tango," the method is avec butter.

In AN, the method is avec Wagner.

Compare and contrast.  Discuss.  (20 pts.)
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TrojanHorse
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« Reply #670 on: June 23, 2007, 04:28:13 PM »

Uh, "Apocalypse Now" is a masterpiece and an epic production, and "Last Tango..." is a fat old guy muttering about existential malaise while banging this hot young chick.

"Apocalypse Now" is about Martin Sheen being assigned to terminate with extreme prejudice an old fat guy muttering about existential malaise because he has "gone native" and has no "method" to his madness at all.


I got a kick out of this...I never really thought of the two characters played by Marlon Brando as being the same guy -- but you're actually not far off at all there...

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TrojanHorse
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« Reply #671 on: June 23, 2007, 05:03:00 PM »

.. it was actually sort of a trick question...I was sort of looking for you to say "How can you possibly discuss the movie without comparisions to  Heart of Darkness?  Which I think would have been a completely reasonable response.

But you are right, it WAS a great movie on many other levels also.  I saw Apocalypse now on Geary Street in San Francisco on Opening Night  (I can't recall the name of the theater now).  I remember how well the new (at that time) audio technology conveyed the fear of actually being under attack.  I involuntarily ducked in my seats in a few scenes as I could hear the bullets whizzing just a few inches over my head...

and of course the enduring lines such as "I love the smell of napalm in the morning.  The smell of Victory"

But really I thought it was the complete package. It was very nearly all that a movie can be - in that it it gives you most of what great literature does but also takes you further by visually and emotionally pulling you into the experience more deeply.

So I'm glad you enjoyed it also...

I'm not looking to pick a fight...I recall finding Shampoo trite as opposed to meaningful, but as you suspected it was many years ago, and the internal (or societal) struggle that you found engaging was not of interest to me back then...I probably found it obvious and overstated...often when you are young you think you know it all and maybe that was my problem...  What you found as Brando's meaningless ramblings, challenged me more at the time. Just as I find Hemmingway's personal progression particularly fascinating. That doesn't make either one of us right or wrong - as I was trying to say in my earlier posts I think it just depends on where you are in life..and maybe even what you had for dinner that night...   Smiley


I'll watch it again and let you know if it strikes me differently today...
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chauncey.g
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« Reply #672 on: June 23, 2007, 05:06:26 PM »

Uh, "Apocalypse Now" is a masterpiece and an epic production, and "Last Tango..." is a fat old guy muttering about existential malaise while banging this hot young chick.

"Apocalypse Now" is about Martin Sheen being assigned to terminate with extreme prejudice an old fat guy muttering about existential malaise because he has "gone native" and has no "method" to his madness at all.


I got a kick out of this...I never really thought of the two characters played by Marlon Brando as being the same guy -- but you're actually not far off at all there...



That's why this scumbag lurker lurks. Boyd 'n Bottle. Bottle 'n Boyd.
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chauncey.g
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« Reply #673 on: June 23, 2007, 05:08:50 PM »

and of course the enduring lines such as "I love the smell of napalm in the morning.  The smell of Victory"


I've always thought the line "Someday this war is gonna end" was significantly more significant.
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TrojanHorse
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« Reply #674 on: June 23, 2007, 05:09:16 PM »

I often thought the character of Larry Darrow in The Razor's Edge I reminded me of Hemingway and I found it particularly interesting in the film version with Bill Murray, that they made him an ambulence driver.  It's been many many years since I read the book, but I don't recall him being an ambulence driver in the book.

Not sure if  Maugham knew Hemmingway personally or not, but he always asserted, I beleive, that he didn't make much up in the novel...probably a complilation of 2-3 people
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