Escape from Elba
Exiles of the New York Times
January 18, 2018, 10:22:08 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: As you may have noticed, this is a very old backup, I'm still working through restoring the site.  Don't be surprised if you post and it all goes missing....
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register  
Pages: 1 ... 195 196 [197] 198 199 ... 299
  Print  
Author Topic: Movies  (Read 33283 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
harrie
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 1143



View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2940 on: December 22, 2007, 06:48:21 PM »

bottle, I like your characterization of Bond (our hero as womanizer, gambler, spy obligated to do unsavory things, etc.) even though I'm not a huge fan of the Bond franchise; so the Carly Simon theme song is nicely ironic or double-edged or whatever you want to call it. 

It's funny, though, because while I can see Connery being so bad he's good (as hinted at in the song Nobody Does it Better), I just don't see Roger Moore that way.  Moore was like a bloaty guy who pulled gadgets out of his pants when he got in a bind, while Connery's Bond actually used his wits, wile, and uh...other stuff to do what he had to do.  Just my Bond $.02, and I'm nowhere near any kind of officianado on the subject.
Logged
jbottle
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 2387


View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2941 on: December 22, 2007, 07:43:16 PM »

"...a bloaty guy who pulled gadgets out of his pants when he got in a bind..."

This is known as "resourceful" in certain circles...no, I agree with your point of Moore being the "cheeky" and not charming/killer one that Connery could have been if it had gone a shade darker, so that by the time of the Simon song you kind of have the happy accident where it's one of the first Moore films, "The Spy Who Loved Me...," so the timing of that and not some jazzy cocktail martini song about ruthlessness, but a kind of affection for for "somehow you found me," and that actually has a little bit of creepiness, like the girl who got snowed by Bond:  "I wasn't looking"/"...but somehow you found me," and yet, you're right that the irony or refrain shouldn't be as strong with Moore, it seems almost impossible without his presence and that time when the Rat Pack cool had to go a little more "not square," and that's really when they started hiring pop stars to do a Bond song.  If you clicked on the ponder link, I think it embodies the cheekiness and goofiness and sincerity, whatever the word is for things that can co-exist at the same time, Ween and the Coen Bros. are the ones who have that rare sense of humor to not abandon heart, and vice versa, and every which a way in between, but yeah, the Simon song would've been a sharper contrast with a meaner Connery, but as it was, Roger Moore played Bond pretty close to the vest in "The Spy Who Loved Me," still charismatic in a way that few are on screen, it's never as easy as he makes it look, great actor, but yeah, I think you should rent TSWLM with the idea that it's the first (or second or third, maybe) Bond that Moore did before, perhaps, his supercilious libido seemed to overwhelm a lot of what should be deadly spy work.  So, I think at the time it was pretty hip of them to put Carly Simon to work on that song, very smart, and I'm just saying continue to push the envelope with Ween and Snipes doing "007: Save Yourself," with the Ween song and a kind of beat poet CIA Felix played by Peter Saarsgaard, it makes perfect sense to me, the irony is that the audience is surprised that Saarsgaard, who has crippling social anxiety, has no problem being a "man of action," his second scene where he shoots a bad guy in the back of the head, I would like to see a Bond movie that could entertain again, instead of going from the "Bourne" playbook, because there's a better character to exploit, more jokes to tell, and some real humanity by revitalizing the best of the Bond films.  I guess when I grew up, I looked back on the Moore "Bonds," and thought, they weren't quite stoned enough, they were so close, but not quite, but the Bond that he is playing in "The Spy Who Loved Me" is not the Moore self-parody Bond of "Moonraker," nice pun there, I guess, you know, moon, a "rake," anyway, I'm a fan of the series, and just wish they had continued to use music to make it more fun for people.
Logged
harrie
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 1143



View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2942 on: December 22, 2007, 08:04:09 PM »

Thanks for the well-reasoned opinion, jbottle.  I confess to not really knowing my Moore Bond flicks too well, so appreciate the insight as to why Moore isn't necessarily a worse Bond than Connery, just a different one. 

With holiday weekends coming up, it's about time for SPIKE or someone to do the Bond-a-thon, so maybe I can do some catching up that way. As long as I make sure to catch the one of the ones with Jill St. John in the white bikini, I think the hubby won't argue too much. ("Honey, the Jill St. John one is coming up next, just hang in there....")  Yeah, that could work.

So jbottle, are you dropping the Sundive script and moving on to Bond?  The more I see of Peter Saarsgaard, the more underrated I think he is.
Logged
oilcanboyd23
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 1613



View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2943 on: December 22, 2007, 08:09:01 PM »

Jbottle's post was too long to read, but I did skim it a little.  Is Saarsgaard Bond?  Or is he the bad guy in the Wesley Snipes Bond picture?  I like it either way, but I think I like the latter better.
Logged
jbottle
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 2387


View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2944 on: December 22, 2007, 08:13:50 PM »

I hadn't thought of it but I guess he's the lead in "Sundive," easy, thanks for making me think that, but yeah, he can do whatever you tell him to do, I liked him mainly as the dutiful editor in that National Republic one, he played that arrogance of intelligence perfectly, to almost where you didn't like him, but then you did, ultimately, he was great in "Kensey," he could funking play James Bond, I think, I mean he's good-looking, and the arrogance could compensate for a sort of small stature, I think we're on to something, whatever it might be, hars, but I'll never abandon "Sundive," even if Aston Kutchner had to do it.
Logged
oilcanboyd23
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 1613



View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2945 on: December 22, 2007, 09:09:46 PM »

Good Saarsgaard work also includes "The Salton Sea" (which I've blathered about here often) and "Year Of The Dog".
Logged
jbottle
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 2387


View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2946 on: December 22, 2007, 09:14:25 PM »

Dive Bar, 11:09PM

Felix [looking straight ahead, seeing Bond in the barmirror, eating nuts]:  Why do you want me to die WITH YOU.

Bond:  I'd like to order a drink.

Felix:  You would, you would like to, hey, Sam, we need vodka.

Bond:  Keep your voice down, Felix, now you sound like a man who wants to die.

Felix:  I don't get to pick, baby, I've been waiting here for half an hour picking almonds out of this bowl and drinking lousy Scotch, I shouldn't be here, and YOU ARE LATE.

Bond [waiter appears]:  Vodka Martini, shaken, not stirred.....

Waiter:  Very Well.

Felix:  What you don't know is that we are, we are both, the only thing that I can tell you that will HELP YOU, is that you are KNOWN, and the longer you stand next to me the hotter my SEAT GETS.

Bond:  Are they moving any material?  

Felix:  Yes.  What day?  Today?  Yes.  I don't, I don't know, I don't think you understand, what...

Bond:  I'm findining Fischer, that's what...

Felix:  ...you don't...Fischer, well, do you want the directions to the morgue or do you want to borrow my GPS...

Bond [grabs Felix]:  If he's gone then, then do you know who might've, don't you know, do you....

Felix [laughs]:  James, you're chasing an animal that chases it's own tail, you should have another martini, they took a flight to Dubai hours ago, and you know that already, so why, so why are you buying me drinks...?

Bond:  I thought it was the other way round...

Felix:  I'm not paying for shit...

Bond:  No, Felix, I didn't expect you to be here at all, yes, if you don't mind...

Bartender:  Martini?

Bond:  Yes.
Logged
madupont
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 5413


View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2947 on: December 22, 2007, 09:14:49 PM »

One take; two, a partial take stands correction if necessary; a down and out question about where did I feel that Dogma and Scandinavian film were so much the same that I could not tell them apart?

Daniel Craig is the likeliest Bond for the time being.  He made the transition nicely into knowing how to dress and talk romantic trash but I am not sure whether movies foster illusion or does illusion foster movies?

Which leads us to Peter Sarsgaard playing Clyde Martin; dig this, dialog:
Clyde Martin: You know what amazes me? There's no relation between how sexy a girl looks and her sex life. The ugly ones seem to get all the action.

                                               ~  ~  ~

Clyde Martin: You know, this thing between Prok and me was fine for a while, but I guess I just really miss sleeping with women.
Alfred Kinsey: That's perfectly understandable. It's clear from your history you have a greater sexual interest in women than men.
Clyde Martin: Good. Then you wont mind if I ask Mac to have sex with me. Only if it appeals to you, of course.
Clara McMillen: Would it be separately or together?
Clyde Martin: Oh, no, definitely just you and I.
Clara McMillen: I think I might like that. What do you think, Prok?


Okay, here's the question. Am I mistaken that there was a fluctuating  narrative in this script. Different narrative points of view. And sometimes Mrs. Alfred Kinsey had the most interesting narrative of all. For any one who doubts intrasexual tolerance arrived between the end of the 1940s and the mid-1950s, well they obviously weren't born yet to be telling the rest of us that we are homophobic; pish and tosh, toss out the polymorphous perverse, and Get a Life!

And that's not all, Liam Neeson has to go out of his way to look as square as Kinsey was at the time, meanwhile proving in the words and writings and research of Kinsey that the acceptance of a multisexually active lifestyle had been there all along in practice, as subjects were knocking on the door to be allowed an interview to tell their experiences although this in itself is not odd because it is generally labeled simply,"Narcissism, non-complex".
              
Now for the Third state of affairs known as Dogma 95 in which the chief exponent is a depressive, thus often the Dogma films are oddly Scandinavian in style and I've come round robin in that I thought I saw Peter Sarsgaard in there in my title-less film. We'll just call it, Name that Film: in which a son realizes when his father throws a big family party celebration of His Own Birthday, more or less for Acknowledgment of his superior procreative capacity to have produced such a large family, son gets pissed off and lets a few cats out of the bag for the enjoyable horror of all.

Anyone able to name that scandal? (plus who was it that looked like a sARSGAARDian on overdrive?)
Logged
jbottle
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 2387


View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2948 on: December 22, 2007, 09:41:49 PM »

Sexual preference and sex is a continnuum, so that a guy who might have like, 10% fag in him is not going to jump the fence into ACTION.  Yeah, we get it, it's not black and white, and it has to do with chemistry levels and and whatnot, someone with 18-22% fag in there is likely to hold one hand over one eye while intoxicated and striking out at the straight bars.  But for those of us in the 2-7% range, it's not an experiment at all, somebody is going  to get their ass kicked, and I hate that the world is that way.  A lot of cops fall into the 9-32% range, that's why they are so weird and become cops in the first place.

Am I going to judge that cop?

No.

Am I going to admit to .0003% fag, sure, if it makes THE COMMUNITY feel better.  We all have a little fag in us, but some people take it up as a lifestyle and get the cable package and shit.  Hey, no prob.

I'm a closeted wannabe homicidal maniac, but then, I think, ah, better NOT DO THAT. 

So I'm in general agreement that we all have to deal with the violent or sexual beast inside our dome's, but normally after a couple of beers I relax and am quite charming.
Logged
harrie
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 1143



View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2949 on: December 23, 2007, 09:52:51 AM »

Sorry madupont, doesn't ring any bells with me.
Logged
madupont
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 5413


View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2950 on: December 23, 2007, 01:05:22 PM »

You missed the new Bond filmed in Montenegro as if it were Cannes? Not that they pretended it was;merely that it was less expensive to do. A blond Bond is a shift in aesthetics. It was also now allowed that he could become a romantic, under the right circumstances. They decided to upgrade his physical  attributes by a more revealing torture scene which must appeal to some warped mentality in the film-going community;and is a reminder, that when going out with a group that spontaneously gets together to discuss a film post-viewing, not to accept the offer of a ride home afterward from a stranger.

The Sarsgaard appearance in Kinsey is one of his more endearing performances , as perhaps a victim of academic authoritative professorial enthusiasm when he joins the researching team who are interviewers on sexual behavior.

Back in the actual time-frame, it never occured to us("us" being either my mother's generation,and of course she was a doctor's wife as well has having been a nurse, or my own age-group) to ask "what about Mrs. Kinsey?".  It turned out that she had a more interesting "story-line" than the expected wife of the 1940s-1950s who always obeyed her husband while doing the housework; she felt troubled like many others as being overlooked by a husband married to his sociologically scientific research on sexual behavior.

So given that Sarsgaard has an important role in the film as an actual character, or composite actuality, he handles the challenge quite well and turns in one of his more fully developed performances intellectually of someone who must continually analyze the emotional shocks of confronting less known about "deviant" behaviors encountered in his interview subjects; much less put up with the continual dominance of personality in the man for whom he rather inadvertently found himself working.  All of us have encountered a research project in the behavioural sciences; but it turns out that Kinsey may have been an enthusiast of obsessive-compulsive proportions.

This of course led me topically to the next film because Dogma95 films do something of the kind in filming the acting with less intellectualizing, so you as the viewer have to decide for yourself what you are observing. I'm not sure that it is less dramatic than Bergman for instance but Bergman does provide more dramatic production values and settings, which are foreign to all but the Scandinavians among us,while revealing a story according to the conventional classical rules for Dramatists.

The newer film makers from Europe leave it to us to recognize what we think it is about according to our own experience, as if we were "voyeurs" and just eaves-dropping.  I had a friend going for her masters degree of Art who referred to it as, "Let's go people-watching".
Actors of course do it all the time, hoping to perceive the exceptional gesture of emotional reaction or some either subtle or dramatic facial expression.
Logged
ponderosa
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 585



View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2951 on: December 23, 2007, 04:06:21 PM »


I'm glad you liked it. As I've said before, I sat down on an average Saturday afternoon much like this one today and thought, after a few minutes, that I was watching a comedy of sorts; much like the one often described to me by people who read the book at the suggestion of the moderator at the nytimes.com forums


It was quite comical considering the subject matter. I'm really interested in reading the book.
Logged
ponderosa
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 585



View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2952 on: December 23, 2007, 04:17:00 PM »


Thank's for the link, ponder, doesn't it sound kind of corny/inspiring/goofy enough for the perfect theme to the sort of Roger Moore cheeky (dare I say postmodern near parody) incarations of 007 in the 1970's.

So vote now, favourite bond tune...


I believe it would fit right in with the eclectic mix of Bond title themes. As a matter of fact if the vote is still open I'll opt for it in anticipation of your idea being realized.
Logged
harrie
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 1143



View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2953 on: December 23, 2007, 04:33:04 PM »

You missed the new Bond filmed in Montenegro as if it were Cannes? Not that they pretended it was;merely that it was less expensive to do. A blond Bond is a shift in aesthetics.

No -- well, yes, I did miss, or rather did not see the Daniel Craig as Bond flick; but I meant that your Name That Film description didn't ring any bells with me.
Logged
ponderosa
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 585



View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #2954 on: December 23, 2007, 05:55:12 PM »


Now, it makes sense. When somebody messes with your mind long enough to scapegoat your reputation, you take precautions.
 

The world had been messin' with me as far as I can remember. I occasionally throw caution to the wind, only to see my proverbial kite get blown away and stuck up in the tree.

Merry Christmas to all.
Logged
Pages: 1 ... 195 196 [197] 198 199 ... 299
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.20 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!