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Author Topic: Movies  (Read 53150 times)
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BorisBartenov
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« Reply #4260 on: May 27, 2008, 01:19:23 PM »

Twas "Husbands and Wives" where Pollack and Woody Allen intersected -- Pollack is married to Judy Davis, and has a hottie on the side.

Yeah, he made solid mainstream films, the kind that hold up and you can get into decades later.  Like the Jbot says, that ain't easy.  The only one I can't really remember is the one I saw with my uncle after we had both burned one -- The Electric Horseman -- and my memory is like this literal-minded nothing where I just think of a horseman, and he's....uh, electrified.   I respect Mary Jane as a muse, to be used sparingly in moments when the unconscious just kludges up and refused to help your creative process, but it won't help you forming longterm memory.

 
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"History doesn't repeat itself, but it often rhymes."
BorisBartenov
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« Reply #4261 on: May 27, 2008, 01:27:48 PM »

OK, Valerie Perrine (as well as Redford and Fonda) was in TEH, and I recall having the hots for her, which I now can't imagine, fathom, or otherwise decode in the ancient cryptography of the libido-past.  But perhaps this following is noteworthy:

She became the first woman to display (on purpose) her nipples on American network television during the May 4, 1973 broadcast of Bruce Jay Friedman's play Steambath (1973) (TV) shown on Hollywood Television Theater (PBS). The story offered an unusual portrayal of the afterlife with "God" presented as a Puerto Rican steam bath attendant. Bill Bixby played a man who refused to admit that he had died. Valerie was seen taking a shower from all sides. Only a few PBS stations were adventurous enough to carry the program.

If there is more than one portrayal of God as a Puerto Rican steam bath attendant, I'm not aware of it.




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harrie
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« Reply #4262 on: May 27, 2008, 03:33:08 PM »

I really enjoyed Sidney Pollack's work, sometimes before I was aware it was his work.  By box office and critical acclaim, I'm guessing Out of Africa is his biggest success, but I think Tootsie is my favorite Pollack film.  It was completely gooberish yet sweet, and topical (fictional Dorothy Michaels as a no-nonsense feminist, while real person and her portrayer Michael Dorsey is a poster child for male chauvinist pigs), with Michael Dorsey becoming a full-fledged human being through his portrayal of a woman.  I laid it on a little thick, but it's really all there in the flick.  Even with the serious undertones, Tootsie is a genuinely funny movie on the surface, too -- so in my book you can't go wrong with it.

Plus, for a rainy afternoon, with bonus points if you're 1) nursing a broken heart and have ice cream in the house;  or 2)  sick with a cold or the flu -- I don't think you can beat The Way We Were.  Though I must admit it hasn't held up that well over time, and Redford's just a little too Ken-doll looking, there's some sentimental undercurrent, a longing for things that could have been, if only....and all that stuff. If that's the itch you have to scratch, TWWW is the way to go.  IMHO of course. 

I think it's also interesting, particularly when right now directors tend to concentrate on a genre and not diversify, that Pollack could do so many different kinds of films -- from flat-out comedy to weepers to spy tales -- and do them so well.  Not to mention the acting here and there, just for giggles.   I hope someone does a retrospective or Pollack Day soon (hear that, TCM?).

Speaking of which, Three Days of the Condor is on overnight on TCM, but it looks like just a coincidental scheduling thing.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2008, 03:41:51 PM by harrie » Logged
madupont
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« Reply #4263 on: May 27, 2008, 03:54:03 PM »

jbottle,re:#4925

"he self-deprecatingly referred to himself as "Mr. Mainstream." , which he could because he produced Michael Clayton.

Also because Three Days of the Condor was actually Operation Condor(same year as the "Three Day..."film was released).

"officials threatened to assassinate US Congressman Edward Koch in mid-1976. In late July 1976, the CIA station chief in Montevideo received information about it, but recommended that the Agency take no action"

I first learned of this and saw it in the film named after the "operation" which was shown on Sundance Channel which did show the shot of Koch talking in the street to an obviously much taller GHW Bush and asking him  as director of the CIA for his help.

"In an interview for the book(by John Dinges, in 2004), Koch said that George H.W. Bush, CIA's director at the time, informed him in October 1976 — more than two months afterward, and after Orlando Letelier's murder* — that "his[Koch's] sponsorship of legislation to cut off US military assistance to Uruguay on human rights grounds had provoked secret police officials to 'put a contract out for you'". In mid-October 1976, Koch wrote to the Justice Department asking for FBI protection. None was provided for him....

In late 1976, Colonel Fons and Major Gavazzo(among them Colonel José Fons, who was at the November 1975 secret meeting in Santiago, Chile, and Major José Nino Gavazzo, who headed a team of intelligence officers working in Argentina in 1976, where he was responsible for more than 100 Uruguayans' deaths)
 were assigned to prominent diplomatic posts in Washington, DC, but the State Department forced the Uruguayan government to withdraw their appointments, with the public explanation that "Fons and Gavazzo could be the objects of unpleasant publicity." Koch only became aware of the connections between the threats in 2001.[32]see,wiki,Operation Condor"; The real reason, according to the documents, was the threat against Koch (see Document 3).http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB112/



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Orlando Letelier was blown up with a car bomb, and what I heard in the showing of Operation Condor on Sundance was that was how Koch appeals to Bush who according to the film, answers him,"You know, Ed, we are in the Information business, Intelligence, not the protection business. You have to provide that on your own." (I paraphrase of course but that was the gist of what I heard.)
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madupont
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« Reply #4264 on: May 27, 2008, 04:41:56 PM »

harrie,

Nope, Out of Africa is no where near as well liked as Tootsie, according to the polls that they are doing today.  Personally, I like OoA, for very complicated literary reasons having to do with reading Isak Dinesen when I was somewhere about age 21; and, then again, nothing prepared me for the film, which --jbottle might be interested in this part--three world famous directors before Pollack  wanted to produce: Orson Welles, David Lean, Nicholas Roeg. It, however, took Sydney two years with assistance from Luedtke, a name familiar to me, rather than the screenwriter or even biographer of Karen von Blixen, to adapt from three books she herself wrote from her life in Kenya, to come up with what they referred to as "the spine" on which to hang their film.

The person who maintains the KvB web-site, made obvious that she dislikes Pollack,"the director" very much for allowing Redford to do very unlike Denys Finch-Hatton type of things, gestures toward Streep as Karen whom she idolizes as a  very Modern type of Feminist (this is almost as bad as when the editor of Ms magazine did a defense of Hillary in the nytimes.blog spot  and now in this last week,May 23, is taking hits from the public asking for the former Playboy bunny: if she has any further comments on Mrs. Clinton's further comments about what if something should happen to Obama and should not Hillary be there as nominee in waiting?).

But as I checked out today in order to discover why Sydney included the 2nd.Boer War references in his scenes, the future Baroness von Blixen was all of age 15 when the taking of the Transvaal occurred and British dominance in East Africa and South Africa remained supreme for the time being.  Karen and Bror Blixen-Finecke didn't show up in Kenya until 1914 when the First World War was about to begin; and she didn't leave until after the Great world wide Depression which was a very sad leave-taking indeed.

The inclusion by Pollack allowed for a great deal of whip-cracking at lions they had to bring from California to scare Streep, because Africa does not allow use of real indigenous African lions on location(too dangerous), and imdb says they controlled the lions on set with high power "fire extinguishers"

So, anyway, the web-mistress likes the romantic version, and Pollack shot his own romantic version whicn another reviewer today agrees with me about it is ahead of its time in shoving the lush reality of East African history as lived under our nose and the social politics.

I say that Streep did certain things as an actor that she has never done or been seen doing in her other films, and Pollack agreed and mentioned it when he got the award and she was by passed. I also know enough now about Isak Dinesen, thanks to the web-mistress, to realize she was no Modern Feminist,there is correspondence between the two parties played by Streep and Redford that they would have had a child but disagreed about the feasibility of that, and whether that occurred after his affair with Beryl Markham is another matter. So the two central characters to this drama telegraphed each other in code and went their separate ways.

That's kind of like Tootsie! Hoffman wrote Pollack a Tootsie telegram asking him to please be
" my agent", signed Dorothy; and this was all very well until they were on the set together as actors. Then the insults began. You see Pollack began as an actor with Meissner and schooled at Neighborhood Playhouse and then was drawn to directing.  He said that it was because he was an actor that he knew exactly how to direct other actors, plus his joke about having the option to spy on how other directors work and that they tend to demarcate their territory like "lions who pee on the four corners of the set". I am trying to picture Woody Allen as a small Jewish lion from Astoria. I can do a little better with Stanley Kubrick as a very black bearded,black-maned villainous lion who probably inspired Uncle whatever his name (with the Jeremy Irons voice)in the Lion King.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2008, 08:45:57 AM by madupont » Logged
jbottle
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« Reply #4265 on: May 27, 2008, 05:44:24 PM »

I can't imagine anyone more fun to work for than Clint Eastwood of today's top directors.
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jbottle
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« Reply #4266 on: May 27, 2008, 09:55:56 PM »

Harrie:  IJ4 did 151.95M meaning that your 153 number was within a percentile (.74%?) of the bullseye, which means that you've bested everyone on the entire internet, print, video, marketing players, professional and otherwise, in box-office prognostication, I think the temptation with this one was to over or under-guess, instead of thinking that it would be more in line with "Pirates" or "Spider-Man," which it was, which is not to diminish but to compliment your sound "instinct(s), so anyway, for a Tuesday that may have felt like a Monday, that's a win somewhere where they count zeroes and ones, and your number, kid, had glitter all over it.

Sometimes you meet the number, sometimes the number meets you, either way, it's a feeling of deep simpatico, and you stare hard into the stars as the wind hits you on the right night, and you feel that ethereal bliss of those who have come before, that divining rod still pointed at the water and itself buried in soil, on those days, you hear the ancient whisper that tells you that nobody knows anything, and you smile, and wonder if it's true for a minute.

You split the arrow.  Enjoy.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2008, 10:03:07 PM by jbottle » Logged
harrie
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« Reply #4267 on: May 27, 2008, 11:06:14 PM »

jbottle, thank you for the affirmation and the final box office numbers. I attribute my success to beginner's luck. (Which is not to say that it doesn't count or anything....)
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jbottle
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« Reply #4268 on: May 27, 2008, 11:51:52 PM »

"Let's get 'lucky'..."--Dignan

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madupont
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« Reply #4269 on: May 28, 2008, 01:28:35 AM »

Twas "Husbands and Wives" where Pollack and Woody Allen intersected -- Pollack is married to Judy Davis, and has a hottie on the side.

Yeah, he made solid mainstream films, the kind that hold up and you can get into decades later.  Like the Jbot says, that ain't easy.  The only one I can't really remember is the one I saw with my uncle after we had both burned one -- The Electric Horseman -- and my memory is like this literal-minded nothing where I just think of a horseman, and he's....uh, electrified.   I respect Mary Jane as a muse, to be used sparingly in moments when the unconscious just kludges up and refused to help your creative process, but it won't help you forming longterm memory.

 


"when the unconscious just kludges up and refused to help your creative process, but it won't help you forming longterm memory."

Oh, come on, I have some very long term memory that there are two kinds of toke'n passers around the big round table of life, sitting there at the very same time, those who have a high degree of shared esp during the experience and recall it quite well the following day, and those who sit there passively like sludge and don't recall a bit of the conversation spoken or unspoken, the next morning. This was the commune experience of the tail end of the Sixties. But truth be told, I think you are on to something with The Electric Horseman. I mean, I do remember They Shoot Horses Don't They?

The thing with Pollack though.... (inhale) hold that thought... MrUtley sent me over to the Washington Post for something utterly about Hillary may she lose her soul, etc. and I ran into this other thing in Slate(link) exhale if there is any left...by....Bryan Curtis...The Grown-UpSydney Pollack's alternative cinema for the old.

I have just been lamenting this fact that there is no alternative cinema anymore. If it sells, they run it and something  just like it, over and over again the same thing for weeks on end, so that I may go to three movies in six months in my brand new nearby multiplex which has to add even more before Heath Ledgers arrives as The Joker.

I make up for it by discovering really old movies  that didn't make it to tv as cable should manage even among Republicans.  Which is how I was able to see, The Sea Within, quite recently, and it was quite different than I supposed it was when it arrived from Spain several years ago with a jolly, good natured agnostic quadriplegic who knows how to project his astral body when he "feels" aroused by an amatory emotion.  His argument with a likewise quadriplegic priest about his right to die is another high point, as well as his disconnecting from more cast members than you can conveniently handle but who are all related to him in some way, at the eventual point where he takes his death into his own hands--which is a metaphor of course for the right to take one's own life when your hands can't manage.

In Spanish, it is called Mar Adrento; did I mention that this is Javier Bardem as the very opposite of Anton Chigur. It's only four years old. (and of course, I'm more Sydney's age, as it was, so that calls for a whole other kind of movie) But, whomever said it, was it you(?), about No Country for Old Men, it is kind of like what we dream just before we wake up.  I dream of people, I've never met. It's quite enjoyable, as it is more real life than one normally enjoys in real life.

Obviously, the Coens have been working toward that a long time and here they captured it. The dreamlike quality of life. So I knew exactly what you meant. That is, if that was you, right?

Ps. Nope, that was jbottle who had only seen it once. Likewise.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2008, 01:36:44 AM by madupont » Logged
jbottle
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« Reply #4270 on: May 28, 2008, 09:21:59 AM »

It seemed like an aging cops bad dream, especially as we close with the rather ordinary breakfast scene that is somehow less lyrical than the rest of the film.  I don't think it matters whether you could make the argument, the conversation beween the Sheriff and his father was interesting but not very dreamlike, and some of it is just great noir storytelling.  I don't think the "dream" theory works all that well but Chigurh seems more like a force of nature or a figment of the imagination, which he is, in McCarthy's novel of course.

Up next:  "There will be blood..."
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oilcanboyd23
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« Reply #4271 on: May 28, 2008, 10:51:06 AM »

Up next:  "There will be blood..."


Mark it!!  Please report back to us as soon as it's done, so I can post my take, which necessarily involves spoilers.
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jbottle
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« Reply #4272 on: May 28, 2008, 09:30:35 PM »

Will do.  I saw that the new 15 sec. ad for TIH is one where Bruce Banner says "There are certain parts of my personality that are difficult to control..." and...

[cue military drums and tnt]

...so it seems they finally got the message that it's character-driven, but the teaser during the NBA is a good financial move I think...

...and part of the Marvel momentum is tied to a Hulk win, I think they need to sell this one, and craft a Downey ad, where Downey (as Iron Man) says (whether it's in the movie or not)...

Scientist:  "We have an unusual problem..."

Stark:  "Yes, you do..."

"We have a security breach..."

Stark:  "He's got a problem with anger, right?"

[cue military drums and tnt]

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nytempsperdu
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« Reply #4273 on: May 28, 2008, 09:44:28 PM »

Re jbot & Valerie Perrine
Quote
I recall having the hots for her, which I now can't imagine, fathom, or otherwise decode in the ancient cryptography of the libido-past

Much may depend on whether onset of said hots followed viewing of Slaughterhouse Five or Lenny...

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jbottle
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« Reply #4274 on: May 28, 2008, 10:09:18 PM »

Yeah, that wasn't me, but she did appear in Playboy when I was like 10, she was really something to behold, as average as they get.
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