Escape from Elba
Exiles of the New York Times
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Question: What is the best show of the most anticipated new shows this fall?
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Author Topic: Television  (Read 27614 times)
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Kam
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« Reply #90 on: June 10, 2007, 11:58:48 PM »

That was a brilliant final scene... my heart was beating so fast in anticipation.

the bashing that people are doing is just the noise of the dim crowd expecting a finale to be shrink wrapped for them. 

in my opinion, phil getting his was the feel good hit of the series.

tony getting his (?) at the end or not.. well... just cuz you don't get it you shouldn't bash it.
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Kam
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« Reply #91 on: June 11, 2007, 12:16:26 AM »

the fade to black makes sense when we realize the series has been shown through Tony's eyes, and if everything is black.. well that says it all.  Remember Bobby Bacala telling Tony "You probably don't even hear it when it happens huh?"  Tony was likely knocked off.  Perhaps AJ and Carmela too as Meadow stumbles in on the entire scene...

Question: Didn't Patsy Parisi know that Tony and Carm were going to Halstons?

Remember the uncomfortable scene with Patsy and wife at the Sopranos?  The wife fingering the fine china.

Patsi did him in!

A couple of folks on nj.com point out one of the suspicious characters in the restaurant:

gacboy says...

I advise everyone to watch the last scene closely. Look at the patron in the trucker hat. It was David Scantino (Robert Patrick) from season 2 - the owner of the sporting goods store that Tony busted out and left despondant. He clearly has a reason to do harm Tony, having lost his life to Tony's lifestyle, and he looked awful shifty. Coincidence that he was in the diner at the same time? I think not.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2007, 12:19:03 AM by kam » Logged

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Kam
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« Reply #92 on: June 11, 2007, 12:54:48 AM »

Actually.. i'm wrong It wasn't a FADE to black. It was an abrupt cut.  You can take from it what you will...

Theory A) Life goes on for the Sopranos but the audience was whacked
Theory B) Tony got whacked, thus the series fittingly is over

Lot of people are wondering why would Tony get killed?

Why not?  NY remnants and or Carmine Lubertazzi might want him gone.  Patsi parisi may have done it. Paulie was acting suspicious the whole show.  Or it could be that a lone gunmen (the shifty looking guy in halstons who some say was the sporting goods store owner from season two).
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« Reply #93 on: June 11, 2007, 07:47:37 AM »

 I thought I lost my cable signal, its as if the life were snatched from my tube

I was confused then I laughed, my wife was pissed.

one could over-analyze this thing, but the best I got is:

we're watching a guy with his family in a run of the mill diner wondering if in the next second they get blown away or if the the onion rings were good. Its the constant threat to this guy's life that he has chosen. The paranoia/fear they all must accept and incorporate, which most normal people would find crushing (phil's head says "hello").

I'm leaning towards the ultimate family hit.

but....

great series, had me hooked Sunday's at 9 for 8 years


« Last Edit: June 11, 2007, 07:53:05 AM by bankshot1 » Logged

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« Reply #94 on: June 11, 2007, 01:02:56 PM »

I liked the end (though the "tense" cross-cutting between the family eating onion rings and Meadow parallel-parking was a little silly) but question the choice of Journey's "Don't Stop Believin'"--it seems like Chase was intentionally going with a kind of open-ended joke ending, I mean, as good as the song choice on The Sopranos has been, Chase going for a cheesy Journey song to end it was a pretty good joke. 

On the other hand, "John from Cincinnati" was fucking horrible, terrible concept, terrible casting, terrible acting, HBO's worst decision since Stuart Pankin.
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MrUtley3
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« Reply #95 on: June 11, 2007, 01:36:07 PM »

Sopranos ending was a riot! I laughed out loud when AJ set his SUV on fire,, and the gruesomeness of "Grandpa" Leotardo saying "good-bye" to  the twins who moments later take a short ride over his head was classicly dark, dark Chase.

The ending made total sense to me. The title of the episode being "Made in America" and the gathering at the fractured Norman Rockwellian painting of a small town restaurant replete with young lovers, cub scouts, et alia with the sociopathic crime boss and his family sitting in its center...the little bells jingling a warning to Tony or sounding a tiny knell for the viewer each time the door opened...the tension building with Meadow parking her car...will she get there before he gets his...will she get there and see it all happen...and the final cut to black and to silence with the last words heard being "Don't stop"!

Brilliant! Once again we fall for the big idea that everything that ends must make sense to us all---and why is that, when life itself makes so little sense to most everyone?

I absolutely loved this show and will miss it, but I don't regret not knowing Tony's ultimate fate.

The cynic in me says that I'll see that when the movie comes out.

The artist in me says that I can create my own final chapter--and that's okay.

A gift of sorts from the writer/producer.

take the ending of the classic movie,  "Casablanca", when Rick and Captain Renault go off together with the line, "This could be the beginning of a beautiful friendship".

 I've often wondered what actually happened in that friendship as the world war heated up and eventually drew to its own conclusion. What ever happened to those two? Do I need to know for sure? Not really.

Do I need to know for sure what happens to Tony Soprano? Not really...and that, I find is refreshing, in a way.



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Kam
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« Reply #96 on: June 11, 2007, 01:45:53 PM »

Well said, MrUtley.  Especially when on other boards there are so many loud folks who feel they got cheated by Chase.  Oft repeated:  "that ending sucked. i wasted 8 fuckin years of my life"

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« Reply #97 on: June 11, 2007, 02:11:59 PM »


I advise everyone to watch the last scene closely. Look at the patron in the trucker hat. It was David Scantino (Robert Patrick) from season 2 - the owner of the sporting goods store that Tony busted out and left despondant. He clearly has a reason to do harm Tony, having lost his life to Tony's lifestyle, and he looked awful shifty. Coincidence that he was in the diner at the same time? I think not.

Didn't he hang himself in his basement, ashamed at having gambled his family's savings away, etc.?

Robert Patrick is great, and I'm hoping it was him, and when I see it again I'll look very carefully, etc.  But I'm pretty sure the David Scatino character was RIP in Season 2 or 3.
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« Reply #98 on: June 11, 2007, 02:18:48 PM »

I loved the ending, once I got over the shock of the screen turning black.  I thought "what the fu*k?"

But then I realized, life doesn't come in neat endings.  I just assume Tony's life would continue to spiral downhill and he continues to lose control of his gang, due to deaths, incapacitation (Silvio).  the marriage is held together with spit (Tony and Carmela will stay together, barely); AJ is a lost soul; Meadow turned out not to be the sharp one we thought.  She became a lawyer after floundering around, going to defend mobsters, probably.

Probably Tony will go to jail under the RICO law rather than as a mobster.  We've watched the family go downhill and we've seen Tony as the cold blooded killer he really is (gone is the fuzzy warm feeling we got watching him with those ducks in his pool).

If you've seen enough French movies, you know that tidy neat endings don't often show up there.  Chase did the same: he gave you a glimpse into mafia life and it wasn't pretty.  No glorification there.  These mobsters are losers.

I wonder what will Chase come up with next, if anything at all.  What can he possible do to top this and I hope he doesn't give in and go for a full-length movie.
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oilcanboyd23
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« Reply #99 on: June 11, 2007, 02:20:31 PM »

I'm a "Sopranos" addict, and I liked the last episode, thinking about what happened after the cut, etc., but what always had me thinking was the whole Livia thing.

Nancy Marchand was a great actress.  She has a long list of acclaimed performances, of which I have only seen a few.  All I know is she was hilarious as the police commissioner in the "Naked Gun" movie, and as the rich old lady in "Brain Donors".   As far as "The Sopranos", the show was never more interesting than when she was on the screen, and no character since has ever been as funny or as creepy as she was.

I can only imagine what they had in mind for where "The Sopranos" was heading in terms of the ongoing story, etc., that they had to change when she died.





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oilcanboyd23
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« Reply #100 on: June 11, 2007, 02:30:41 PM »

Once again we fall for the big idea that everything that ends must make sense to us all---and why is that, when life itself makes so little sense to most everyone?

Word, but you can still gripe.  I'm not griping, but I can see how one might.  A TV show isn't life, it's a TV show, and people feel like they've given their time, made the investment, and they deserve a payoff, etc.  In my opinion, the payoff was great, even if it left unanswered questions, but that's just my perception.

I'm more miffed about the "Pine Barrens" episode than I am the finale.  How do you just drop the whole Russian mafia story-line and not ever address it ever again?  What happened to that big crazy Russian "interior decorator"?  What happened to Paulie's car, etc.?  I've heard all the, "Well, the show doesn't gift-wrap things or spoon-feed you, etc.," and I buy that to an extent.

For me, dropping the Russian mafia thing without any explanation is like it would be if the finale episode opened with Tony and Phil having lunch and talking about some new project, with no mention of the previous episode in which war was declared and Phil and Tony went into hiding.  Sure, you can always say, "Well, the show doesn't gift-wrap or spoon-feed," but that doesn't help when you're scratching your head saying, "Yeah, but I thought Tony and Phil were at war... did I miss something?"

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« Reply #101 on: June 11, 2007, 03:28:16 PM »

Life doesn't come with neat endings....yeah, but this isn't life, it's television.  No wonder the cast kept their traps shut about the ending.  Most of em probably would like to forget they were part of the con. 

Perhaps they should have paid their writers more...then they would have been willing to actually write an ending to the series.  They could have at least taken a page from the writers of Newhart

I give it  Huh Huh Huh Huh Huh
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oilcanboyd23
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« Reply #102 on: June 11, 2007, 03:31:45 PM »

Life doesn't come with neat endings....yeah, but this isn't life, it's television. 

Were you listening to the Dude's story?

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Kam
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« Reply #103 on: June 11, 2007, 03:35:17 PM »

A con?  I don't feel conned out of anything.  I feel like they've given me something i can think about for years to come. "Don't Stop... believing"

AJ: You always told me to remember the good times.

Tony: I said that?

Livia: Its all a big nothing.

This isn't like Sports where we expect there to be a winner and a loser at the end.  This show was a form of entertainment yes, but a form of art in its own right.  Not sport entertainment.  Art entertainment. 
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MrUtley3
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« Reply #104 on: June 11, 2007, 03:42:04 PM »

I'm a "Sopranos" addict, and I liked the last episode, thinking about what happened after the cut, etc., but what always had me thinking was the whole Livia thing.

Nancy Marchand was a great actress.  She has a long list of acclaimed performances, of which I have only seen a few.  All I know is she was hilarious as the police commissioner in the "Naked Gun" movie, and as the rich old lady in "Brain Donors".   As far as "The Sopranos", the show was never more interesting than when she was on the screen, and no character since has ever been as funny or as creepy as she was.

I can only imagine what they had in mind for where "The Sopranos" was heading in terms of the ongoing story, etc., that they had to change when she died.


I agree with you. Her surviving would have changed everything--and while the character of Janice made the clear link to Livia, she was more distraction than attraction to the show.
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