Escape from Elba
Exiles of the New York Times
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Question: What is the best show of the most anticipated new shows this fall?
Pushing Daisies
Private Practice
Bionic Woman
Chuck
Dirty Sexy Money
Back to You
Big Shots
Cane
Journeyman
Samantha Who?
Other

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Author Topic: Television  (Read 19716 times)
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TrojanHorse
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« Reply #45 on: June 01, 2007, 12:26:14 PM »

Anyone else find it odd that Charlie locked himself in the flooding hatch, when all he had to do was run out and grab the scuba gear?

My wife and i keep speculating that they are going to pull a switch and somehow save him at the last minute when the new season starts...
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Kam
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« Reply #46 on: June 01, 2007, 01:20:09 PM »

Well i assume Charlie shut the door to save Desmond from the station getting flooded.  So Desmond could tell the others that it wasn't Penny's boat.  But what i could see is Charlie taking a deep breath as the waters were rising and swimming through the hole where the grenade went off and up to the surface.
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harrie
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« Reply #47 on: June 01, 2007, 01:20:20 PM »

Anyone else find it odd that Charlie locked himself in the flooding hatch, when all he had to do was run out and grab the scuba gear?

My wife and i keep speculating that they are going to pull a switch and somehow save him at the last minute when the new season starts...

I see the Charlie thing this way -- anyone who played Combat as a kid knows you have 'til the count of five once the pin is pulled on a grenade. Whether this is true in real life, I don't know, but it's one of those rules you don't mess with.  At least I don't. 

So I'm figuring Charlie thinks he has five seconds or less, depending on whether the pin was pulled.  I don't recall whether it was, but I have the episode recorded since we were out of town and I didn't know if I'd be able to catch it, so I should double-check it.   The no-time factor, plus Charlie's being kind of convinced that he's going to die here anyway -- plus Monaghan's starring in a flick that's in pre-production -- elicited the response that it did. Plus, who doesn't want to be a hero?  (tongue in cheek)

Personally, I wondered why he didn't hold his breath, wait for the water pressure to equalize, squirm out the window and float to the surface.  I don't think getting the bends is a big issue or anything. I mean, while he was touring with Driveshaft, if he caught Dateline, 20/20 or the local news at all, he'd pretty much have had to see the story they do about what to do if you drive into a body of water.

Also in the finale, I found that Jack reminded me of Joe in Say Anything  (that would be Joe who is the subject of "Joe Lies" and 60-odd other songs by Lili Taylor) when he tells Kate he did or said something "because I love you, Kate."  WTF mister???  You're doing Juliet and practically joined at the hip with her; and you tell this other girl who's been kind of pining after you and you've been studiously ignoring something like that??  The bedside manner definitely needs work.   

Anyway, just my two cents.
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barton
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« Reply #48 on: June 01, 2007, 02:46:47 PM »

Someone "quoted" me as saying it had to be Benjamin Linus, or Bums Alien Jinn, in the casket.  Wasn't me.  Besides, there is the whole John Lantham thing, which resonates too much with John Locke, especially since another British philosopher was named Bentham and combining them --- AHA! -- produces "Lantham" -- well, or "Benthocke" or what have you. 

I thought Jack's "because I wuv you" line clanked horribly, for the same reason as Harrie.  You don't get to trade fluids with Juliet and say stuff like that.

I've seen a lot of speculation about Charlie and the porthole.  Wasn't it a bit narrow for him to wiggle through?  I think that is the reason he didn't take that option, though I'm not sure why he couldn't close the bulkhead from....the other side.
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TrojanHorse
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« Reply #49 on: June 01, 2007, 04:18:17 PM »

Perhaps it could only be closed from the inside--which is of course how "no" boat or water vessel is actually constructed, but we'll give them artistic license there.

I just don;t think he needed to worry about closing it at all.  Even with the water pouring in, there was plenty of time for both he and Desmond to run over and grab the scuba gear and swin out the same way they came in.  A vessel that size would take a long time to "sink."

So even though he locked himself in AND the porthole is too small to swim through...consider this:   The grenade weakend the structure surrounding the pothole sufficiently so that Charlie can kick a wider hole open (or use a crow bar or whatever) and then swim through.
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TrojanHorse
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« Reply #50 on: June 01, 2007, 04:20:52 PM »

Someone "quoted" me as saying it had to be Benjamin Linus, or Bums Alien Jinn, in the casket.  Wasn't me. 

Yeah...no...sorry...

It was Kam.  who apparently had one of your quotes in his/hers.  I try to delete everything that is not specific to the point and missed your additional inserted name...
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Earl
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« Reply #51 on: June 01, 2007, 10:42:48 PM »

An important factor in Charlie's motivation for doing the diving stunt was Desmond's prediction (courtesy of the vision thing) that if Charlie did it, Claire and Aaron would board a helicopter and be rescued. Charlie likely believed that if he messed with the scenario Desmond described, then the rescue would be scuttled. (The precedent for that had been set in a previous episode, the one where Charlie was supposed to get an arrow in the throat.) Charlie could have gotten out and probably knew it; but he willingly sacrificed himself.

That's my take, anyway.
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madupont
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« Reply #52 on: June 02, 2007, 11:20:58 AM »

There's been a lot of conjecture on that as the End came down on Grey's Anatomy. The haggling had been about the actor Isaiah Washington; who pulled off a contract for another project after another award that he received from the NAACP.

Nontheless, matters of poliltics aside, what the heck Shonda Rhimes eventually did, as her end piece for the series as it has originally been, really put in the last nail!  Many of us were shocked by the particularly
calloused emotion which was chosen as a final comment on the depth of human nature.  It was as if the writer had said,"Okay, guys...this has been fun but here's what I really think!"
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barton
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« Reply #53 on: June 02, 2007, 11:24:23 AM »

Earl, just to play devil's advocate, I will point out that Charlie managed to kick his drug addiction in spite of the island throwing a whole planeful of heroin at him -- this, to me, doesn't suggest the kind of fatalistic personality that would willingly drown just so someone's dream of rescue came out correctly.  Plus there's that thing called a will to live, survival instinct, or whatever.  My feeling is that if he manages to shut down the jamming signal, he would feel he's done his part and would then take a practical approach to survival.  Then again, maybe all those years of doping have taken their toll.

And perhaps there is a rather Buddhist sense of personal unimportance in the Driveshaft song lyric, "You are everybody!"  (sincerely hoping I have not misheard this....)
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harrie
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« Reply #54 on: June 02, 2007, 02:25:33 PM »

My hubs and I play a game involving any character who seems about to be written out of a script/series, it's called "Guess whose contract's up!"

We do the same thing; but because Matthew Fox (Jack) is playing Racer X in the upcoming Speed Racer movie, we thought he might be biting the big one in the finale.  In one way, because I find his character so frustrating at times, I was kind of hoping he'd get it.  But he didn't.  Yet?

To go the purgatory/redemption route, if Charlie believes that his dying will save Claire and Aaron -- which is  what Desmond indicated to him, and Desmond's visions have proven close enough to true in the past that one probably wouldn't totally ignore them -- I could understand him overriding the will to live/survival instinct.  By sacrificing himself to their benefit, he's redeemed himself and dies/goes to heaven or the next plane of existence/leaves the island/whatever you want to call it. Since this theme has been rearing its ugly head throughout the past three years, I don't have too much problem buying into it.
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barton
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« Reply #55 on: June 03, 2007, 02:46:30 PM »

Yeah, it's funny, how the creative staff of "Lost" will always take time to offer firm denials that the island is Purgatory.   I think their idea is that the island offers a form of purgatory that these troubled characters can experience during their lifetime and, possibly, find some redemption before they return to the mundane world.  Or don't return, as in the case of Eko, Shannon, Boone, Libby, Anna Lucia, Federal Marshal Guy, et al.   Most of the island deaths are straightforward, in the sense of "once you're dead on the island, you are really dead," but the ones that aren't, such as Demond's blowing up and then somehow emerging unscratched, or Locke's miraculous rising from the corpse heap, tease at us. 

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lulu
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« Reply #56 on: June 04, 2007, 12:24:12 PM »

Are there any Sopranos fans here?  the pace is getting quicker and things are really going downhill from here fast.  I think that was the first whack job I saw Silvio do.  Lost of surprise here and I will miss the series even though some seasons were less memorable than others.

As for Dr. Melfi, her current moralistic take on Tony is pretty hypocritical.  Her treatment of Tony this week was abominable. 
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Kam
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« Reply #57 on: June 04, 2007, 12:56:35 PM »

They are revealing Melfi to be a 2nd-rate psych.  Notice the derision and mockery she felt at the dinner table from her colleagues.
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You know when, like, you're little, your dad, you think he's Superman. Then when you grow up and realize he's just a regular guy who wears a cape.
-Dave Attell
TrojanHorse
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« Reply #58 on: June 04, 2007, 05:38:33 PM »

Yeah, it's funny, how the creative staff of "Lost" will always take time to offer firm denials that the island is Purgatory.   I think their idea is that the island offers a form of purgatory that these troubled characters can experience during their lifetime and, possibly, find some redemption before they return to the mundane world.  Or don't return, as in the case of Eko, Shannon, Boone, Libby, Anna Lucia, Federal Marshal Guy, et al.   Most of the island deaths are straightforward, in the sense of "once you're dead on the island, you are really dead," but the ones that aren't, such as Demond's blowing up and then somehow emerging unscratched, or Locke's miraculous rising from the corpse heap, tease at us. 



I don't think it's purgatory, although I can see your point.  When Locke's father was there and was convinced that he was dead, there were actually enough clues there as to what really happened...

The people in the ambulance drugged him (just like they did to Julie) and then shipped him to the island...
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Kam
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« Reply #59 on: June 04, 2007, 07:43:32 PM »

One mystery i want to have some light shed on is how ben and the others know so much about the losties.  Did they (Ben, Jacob) have advance knowledge flight 815 was going to crash, or did they gather this intel only afterwards and see the connections between Locke and Sawyer.
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You know when, like, you're little, your dad, you think he's Superman. Then when you grow up and realize he's just a regular guy who wears a cape.
-Dave Attell
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