Escape from Elba
Exiles of the New York Times
June 20, 2018, 08:39:56 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: As you may have noticed, this is a very old backup, I'm still working through restoring the site.  Don't be surprised if you post and it all goes missing....
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register  
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 ... 98
  Print  
Author Topic: Fiction  (Read 25266 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
weezo
Poll Manager
Superhero Member
****
Posts: 3431


Resue when he was a cute little kitten


View Profile WWW

Ignore
« Reply #30 on: June 05, 2007, 05:03:59 PM »

NY Temps,

It certainly is a novel set in its specific time and place. I'm sure that in times ahead, Africa will change from how it is depicted in the book and what it will be like to future readers.

5 day deodorant pads are amusing even to the present, since, back then we were still mostly taking weekly baths where as now we take daily showers. What good is a 5 day deodorant pad if you shower every morning or evening? Reading of the ways in which the missionaries lived reminded me of a long forgotten small event in my childhood. A family moved in down the street from us, missionaries, just back from Africa, and the postman complained to neighbors that the mother answered the door in a bra with a large hole at the point. The story made its way down the block, and was told to Dad at the supper table. Someone on the block was elected to tell the woman as gently as possible, that such attire to answer the door was not appropriate stateside no matter how appropriate it may have been in Africa. That missionary woman was said to have complained back that her life stateside was excessively hard, since she had had servants in Africa, but in Reading, mothers raised their own children and cleaned their own homes.

But, in the Poisonwood Bible it makes it clear that the native servant was essential to keep the family, not in the lap of luxury, but in three balanced meals a day, which was not the norm for the natives. The family is in bad straights between the loss of the housewoman who came with the mission, due to Nathan's loose tongue, and the arrival of a student of the schoolteacher to take her place some time later. The family almost starves to death in the midst of plenty.
Logged
snyggokul
Guest

« Reply #31 on: June 06, 2007, 10:23:43 PM »


(...) I like books that play with identity (...)

Then if you have not, you should most definetely read the play Three Tall Women , by Edward Albee . To begin with, the characters are called A, B, and C, and although, as a play, it is naturally meant to be staged, it is indeed a GREAT read !

Also : The second act brings a coup de théâtre that is among the best and most creative in the history of world theater.  Wink
Logged
madupont
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 5413


View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #32 on: June 07, 2007, 09:20:09 AM »

snyggokul,

I also like Albee, ever since the 1950s,ever since a play with the ingenious title that goes something like this because I ad-lib,"Dad's Hanging in the Closet and Mom's looking so sad".

When I moved to Hopewell, New Jersey, I had a landlord who taught literature at Trenton State College and almost always invited Albee out to the College as a guest on the roster of speakers. Sometimes, these are held over the Easter Break as symposiums; at other times, these are events scheduled for dates throughout the two semesters. I noticed that Edward  Albee was invited almost every year and, since I used to book literary engagements back in the 1960s myself, I presumed accommodations were arranged by the literature teacher who, with a partner, had a very nice house up around New Hope, a little further up the Delaware river.

P.s. will post that review later in Am.History for Nixon and Kissinger.
Logged
snyggokul
Guest

« Reply #33 on: June 07, 2007, 05:41:09 PM »

snyggokul,

I also like Albee, ever since the 1950s,ever since a play with the ingenious title that goes something like this because I ad-lib,"Dad's Hanging in the Closet and Mom's looking so sad". (...)

Yep, Albee does like to give these talks and to teach too; I should actually check if he's still teaching in Texas... My Master's Thesis is called : "Identity and Temporality in Edward Albee's Three Tall Women"Wink  I did the research for it in NY in 1995 -- mostly at the Public Library for Fine Arts at the Lincoln Center -- and also met Albee at the time; we talked and watched the play together, and I told him about the staging of the play here in São Paulo, Brazil, which had opened days before  I left for NY... I reeeeeeeeeeeally like him . A lot. BOTH as a person and as a playwright.

Now... (o.0) You'll simply have to -- please, please, please !!! --- look for the exact title of that play for me when you get the time, madupont, cuz I have never seen that in all the lit I have read & I read pretty much all there was at the time about Albee !!! Oh, boy... To think that I don't HAVE this play DOES disturb me!!!!  Angry  Sad

Quote
P.s. will post that review later in Am.History for Nixon and Kissinger.

OK DOK !  Smiley
Logged
snyggokul
Guest

« Reply #34 on: June 07, 2007, 07:19:01 PM »

Dear  nytempsperdu,

 Kiss You are an ANGEL !!!! (0.o) Man... Did I fret ! Thank you very much for the information. Funny thing is that I thought my mind was playing some trick on me, cuz at the same time that to my knowledge that was not a play by Albee, the name was not entirely unknown to me; that's why I got mixed up and thought: How COME I do NOT have this play Huh ? ... Arthur Kopit, OK !

(0.o) madupont !!! Tsk, tsk, tsk... You BAD boy !!!  Angry  I'm pinching you here !!!
BUT... (0_0)  I like your posts a lot, so I forgive you...  Wink

Logged
madupont
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 5413


View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #35 on: June 07, 2007, 11:15:34 PM »

Who is Arthur Kopit?  (admit, I do recognize the name but can't put a face to it)  Either way, read both playwrights in the Evergreen Review but since that was fifty years ago and before I left for Manhattan, we all can't be perfect.
Logged
kitinkaboodle
Hero Member
*****
Posts: 519


View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #36 on: June 11, 2007, 09:10:18 AM »

For anyone here who may be interested in short story collections/writings you may find Peter Orner's The Esther Stories compelling and worth your time.  Intricate, compassionate...he's a writer who masters many voices.
Logged

Don't dance on a volcano...
madupont
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 5413


View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #37 on: June 16, 2007, 10:51:48 AM »

nytempsperdu re:#54

"This quote is from a poster in the American History forum, but when I first read it my mind raced to The Poisonwood Bible,"

Unfortunately true, "Missions" of religious do-gooders, who have credit to their side for what ever amount of medical care, outside education they suppose that they are able to provide, activities that make them appear to be a Peace corps  of skills derived from their personal experience with their home-geographic terrain, are most often unaware that they are the front-lines of Colonialization; although they turn to their own government of national origin for a certain percentage of their needs for their work (and granted some groups seem to rely entirely on the funds raised by their own denomination), it is little wonder that they readily convince themselves that they are doing what their Lord asked them to do.  They seem unable to grasp that there is any connection between their settlement, with the gradual familiarization of the local population accepting their "outside" difference, and the eventuality later down the line of things going badly awry.  At which point, it made headlines.

What to all appearances at first seems like a kind of "outsourcing", drastically subjugates the colonialized to a non-bargaining position. However, at the moment, I am not just peeved but rather contentious about the political stance of our own current administration which, in the quest for globalized betterment convinced our northern neighbour(while everybody is distracted by the sleight of hand they are raising against our southern border) that "cooperation" would allow corporations, that refer to themselves from their home-base in Canada as "international", to outsource into the US while applying their own   home-rules to US workers who are now in the process as of the last six and a half years of experiencing the "what goes around, comes around effect" while being reduced to a form of peonage in their own country. There is no labor-bargaining, collective bargaining, just an agreement between American goverments already allied into an incestuous relationship with corporatism.

In other words, what used to be considered "white-man's burden" is now, in terms of Anglo-American connections,  an elite privilege only, with the reduction of the life style of the US "middle class" a euphemism for an enacted reduction in wages through loss of collective bargaining while the national cost of living rises.  They have now been "colonized" like other ethnicities in the past, while the administration in power remains confident that despite  belt-tightening,the middle-class, even while allowed to keep their own indigenous religious preference, will take out their frustrations on certain other racial groups whose positive attributes will be diminished while placing an undue emphasis on negatives attributed to their race or place of origin.

It's been done before historically, not only on this continent but more recently in this last century in Europe itself, while being taken for granted in the Middle East(and/or Asia Minor)currently to obtain exotic resources, after our miserable failure to develop peaceful policy in Southeast Asia. Despite the fact that these economic ventures and labor inequities result in wars, our current direction seems to indicate more of the same intentions toward Latin America. We will probably not  continue the use the religious missionary ruse in that direction, anymore than we would have tried to  apply it in the Muslim Middle East and/or continue to apply it to Muslim Africa. (or, Muslim southeast Asia; which has provided me some interesting insights into the campaign of Barack Obama )
Logged
weezo
Poll Manager
Superhero Member
****
Posts: 3431


Resue when he was a cute little kitten


View Profile WWW

Ignore
« Reply #38 on: June 16, 2007, 09:24:02 PM »

Maddie,

I first ran into the missionary abuse of a civilization when I read Hawaii, sometime shortly after high school. I never again supported missionary funds.

I had a heated argument with a priest at one of my sister's wedding some years back (her oldest just graduated HS last week!). The priest had recently returned from a stint somewhere in South America and I made a point of questioning him hard about how they were treating the indigineous people. He kept insisting that by taking the Natives in from the "wild" to be servants and nannies in the homes of rich "civilized" folks, that they were "spreading the culture" to these poor misguided folks. I pointed out that the young mother learning about "modern" child care was unable to apply it to her own children, which were back in the village while she lived all week with the laced ones. I seriously doubt I did anything to change his mind about the "right" way to deal with the indigenous, but I got a lot off my chest!




Logged
lulu
Full Member
***
Posts: 169


View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #39 on: June 19, 2007, 10:17:29 AM »

Wondering if Poisonwood is something I need to read.

I'm anxiously awaiting Harry Potter so until then it's Kite Runner after Woman in White. 

I also have piles of cds to catch up on.

so much to do; so little time.
Logged
Donotremove
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 1068


View Profile Email

Ignore
« Reply #40 on: June 19, 2007, 10:49:29 AM »

Missionaries have been doing their evil work in Central and Latin America since the middle 1800s, often in collusion with the government (or tyrant) in power, but under cover of stealth if that was not forthcoming.  Even when run out of some countries, they bide their time and come back in when the opportunity arises (like Mexicans trying again and again to successfully cross the border into the U.S.).

Read Norman Lewis' "The Missionaries" and learn to wish a stake be driven into the heart of every missionary everywhere.  I've read this book twice (lest I forget).
Logged
Donotremove
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 1068


View Profile Email

Ignore
« Reply #41 on: June 20, 2007, 02:29:45 AM »

I am finally in possession of a paperback copy of the PB by she who is rarely named.  Judging by the first few pages this is going to be a  good book.  How good will later be revealed.  We're going to start talking about it on July one?

I also lucked out ahead of 130 others for a copy of Khaled Hosseini's "A Thousand Splendid Suns" and I can already say  his second book is even better than "The Kite Runner."

For possible boredom back up, I've got Georgina Howell's biography of "Gertrude Bell: Queen of the Desert, Shaper of Nations."

My cup runneth over.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2007, 02:32:17 AM by Donotremove » Logged
Mosca
Newbie
*
Posts: 2


View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #42 on: June 21, 2007, 08:24:22 AM »

Hey DNR, thanks for the invite.  I have a copy of PB, but haven't read it yet.  I thought it was always risky to talk about Kinsolver, but perhaps that was only at the nytf-s, rip.
Logged
desdemona222b
Superhero Member
******
Posts: 1228


That's What I'm Talking About


View Profile Email

Ignore
« Reply #43 on: June 21, 2007, 09:57:59 AM »

Hi, mosca! I was wondering if you'd ever make it over here. 
Logged
Mosca
Newbie
*
Posts: 2


View Profile

Ignore
« Reply #44 on: June 21, 2007, 04:04:04 PM »

Hi D, busy life lately, but I finally found the chance to get here.  I am glad to see a few familiar names.
Logged
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 ... 98
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.20 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!