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Warriors

1 (33.3%)

Celtics

2 (66.7%)

Total Members Voted: 3

Voting closed: June 13, 2022, 11:38:11 PM

[kiidcarter8]

I dont know...pretty darn good team linking Brunson and Mitchell with Barrett and Rand le.  With strong supporting cast as well.

[kiidcarter8]

https://youtu.be/YxB3iE6cEE0

[chipstern]

Well, these people are not sportswriters. They're not journalists.

They're just sort of playing one on the web.

They provide cheap content for various sites, God knows what they get paid, if anything. That's why you see the same nonsensical shit recycled in a million places.

Immanuel Quickley, Quentin Grimes, Obi Toppin, Derrick Rose, 2023 First-Round Pick, 2024 First-Round Pick, 2025 First-Round Pick, 2026 First-Round Pick, 2029 First-Round Pick For Donovan Mitchell

I do believe that Kiid's position is that this adolescent wet dream is a transformative trade that benefits us more than the Jazz. 

The idea that Mitchell is somehow a significant game changer to the point of sundering all future assets and the heart of our second unit is a crock. 

I mean, it really makes me crazy. 

If Mitchell is so great, how did Brunson and the Mavs put Donovan and the Jazz to sleep? 

If Mitchell is so great, why are the Jazz contempating offloading their best player and going into the tank in total rebuild mode?  Would think you would want to rebuild around him. 

FIVE #1 Picks?

FUCK YOU. 

By keeping our powder dry, we could arguably, in the 2023 Draft, package our two #1 picks + X-future #1 picks to move up in the draft to cop next year's Jaden Ivey. 

Said picks could be deployed in some manner should Julius & The Knicks determine it would be best for us all to move on.  Me, I kind of think JR is going to benefit from Jalen running the point.  Likewise Fournier, who in the summer of 2023, would have one guaranteed year left on his deal...

Then again, come next February, a healthy productive Rose, with his team option for 2023-2024, might be packaged for a player or picks.

Finally, this feeding frenzy notwithstanding, tossing all of your eggs in one basket, blowing out all of your assets on one player, and sundering future flex seems counterintuitive to me, and I am heartened that the Knicks did not let themselves be strong armed by this nonsense. 

Quentin Grimes is not 6'1" he is 6'5" 

Quentin Grimes is not 26, he is 22

Quentin Grimes has a ways to go to be the offensive threat that Mitchell is, but he showed enormous progress this summer both as a shooter, scorer and facilitator. 

Quentin Grimes is a solid defender.  Donovan Mitchell is somewhat suspect in that department. 

QUNETIN GRIMES IS NOT DONOVAN MITCHELL.  Quentin Grimes has a considerable ways to go. 

Duly noted. 

I am happy to gague his progress and growing pains as a KNICK.  Likewise IQ and Obi, who made quite the statement to close out 2022. 

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mitchdo01.html

Pretty damn impressive carerr stats for DM: 23.9 ppg, 3.4 reb, 4.5 dimes, .833 FT%

I mean, what's not to like?

Class? 

The Asking PRICE 

FUCK DONOVAN MITCHELL 

[chipstern]

https://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/202204180DAL.html

The series stats are interesting. 

Mitchell was putting up a lot of shots.  A LOT OF SHOTS.  Not very efficient.  Not all that great from trey. 

Hey, in all fairness, what else did Utah have, offensively? 

One could argue that Jalen out played DM, least ways, he mostly matched and in some ways exceeded DM. 

And no, that does not negate Mitchell's cumulative skillset or career consistency. 

Didn't translate into the Jazz rising to the top of the West though, did it. 

Maybe it is time for the Jazz to tear it all down and rebuild it. 

I AM NOT INCLINED TO HELP. 

[facilitatorn]

Hopefully Leon is in your camp, Chip, and Dolan is far far off playing on the road.

Carlos, the sig change was just for you.

Some team will do something really stupid just before training camps open and that will get the ball rolling league wide. Let it not be us.

[chipstern]

Hopefully Leon is in your camp, Chip, and Dolan is far far off playing on the road.

Carlos, the sig change was just for you.

Some team will do something really stupid just before training camps open and that will get the ball rolling league wide. Let it not be us.

Everyone is waiting on Kevin Durant. 

Oh, and LeBron. 

No guarantee that the Knicks won't make a move, big or small. 

But it is prudent to wait things out. 

Grimes, Quickley, Toppin, McBride and Reddish will still be valuiable assets/developing players at the end of September, let alone next February. 

Randle, Fournier and Rose will still be talanted veterans who might be of considerable interest from now through February 2023. 

As for our #1 picks?

2023 [Knicks], 2023 [Dallas]

In trading our #11 to OKC on draft night [Ousmane Dieng], we got back Denver's #1, which we traded to Charlotte for Duren who we forwarded to the Pistons as part of the Walker/Burks/Noel shennanigans.  As I understand it, we got the Pistons protected #1 which they seem to have gotten from the Rockets.  And the Wizards #1, top 14 protected in 2023. 

And a bunch of #2 picks from past transactions with the Jazz, Hornets, Heat, Mavs, Pistons, T-Waolves.  I can't figure it out. 

Our own 2024 #1, sundry #2s

Our own 2025 #1, and a #1 from the Pistons via the Bucks, as I understand it. 

Our own 2026 #1 and sundry conditional #2s. 

All of which can be shuffled and reshuffled. 

Obviously we have a very young roster, so draft capital is not necessarily there to be picked, as roster space is at a premium.  Still, it can be packaged for fewere, BETTER draft picks. 

As things stand now? 

Robinson, Hartenstein, Sims, Toppin, Reddish, Barrett, Grimes, Quickley, McBride. 

That's NINE right there. 

Randle, Brunson.

That's ELEVEN. 

Fournier, Rose.

That's THIRTEEN.

Hunt, Keels.

That's FIFTEEN.

Jokubaitis

That's SIXTEEN. 

So taken with all of that draft capital, we have the assets to mix and match and thin the herd, at the same time we are developing our pups. 

So are deals on the horizon? 

Likely. 

Mitchell? 

Only if the price is right. 

Stay tuned. 

PATIENCE, Butterflies, PATIENCE

Patience?  You never know what kind of tasty treat might appear on the horizon.  The Clippers cashed in when John Wall was bought out by the Rockets, and they got him for what, $6.49 million, with a team option for the second year. 

Seeing as how the Clippers have the highest payroll in the league: $195,331,757

Kawhi Leonard & Paul George: 42, 45 48 [player option]

Norman Powell: 16, 18, 19, 20

Marcus Morris: 16, 17

Luke Kennard: 13, 14, 14 [team option]

Robert Covington: 12, 11

Reggie Jackson: 11

Nicholas Batum: 10, 11

Ivica Zubac: 10, 10, 11

They are in win now mode, and teaming Wall with Jackson at PG [health wlling], a healthy Leonard and George [GOD willing], and with their veteran depth and skill set, they can make a big noise out west. 

However, because the Knicks were proactive in keeping contracts short [Burks, Noel and Rose all on 2 +1's], and thus able to maneuver to swap out draft assets for more draft assets and salary cap space, they were able to pounce on the Clippers' 24 year old center Isaiah Hartenstein right at the point where he is just starting to really peak, and where the Clippers went all in on John Wall and presumably they could not afford his salary plus the luxury tax hit, which seems odd, I mean, in for a dime in for a dollar.  Still, the Knicks were able to swoop in and get him with cap space left over from their Jalen Brunson pursuit. 

Who knows what might come out on the market between now and training camp, between opening night and the February 2023 trade deadline. 

Stay flexible.  Stay prudent.  Stay patient. 

[facilitatorn]

Let Mitchell fall elsewhere, trades resolve, rosters rationalize, dudes get cut, and use one of our two spots for someone good who now that they are available wants to be here.

Or if some one needs one of our well compensated vets we can take back up to three smaller contracts in exchange, maybe to a Texas team that expects to see a lot of Zion.

[facilitatorn]

McDermott Vassel Langford

Wood Bullock

Gordon Eason

for

The Big Jewel, Julius Randle

[chipstern]

McDermott Vassel Langford

Wood Bullock

Gordon Eason

for

The Big Jewel, Julius Randle

Jeeze Louize. 

We have a full roster and a chemistry carry over from last season. 

THIS IS SIMPLY LAME. 

Would you stop already. 

Let's make a trade for Alex Jones while we are at it. 

[facilitatorn]

You are feeling good about chemistry in this team with Randle on the roster? I am asking because I would also like to believe.

[carlos123]

Hopefully Leon is in your camp, Chip, and Dolan is far far off playing on the road.

Carlos, the sig change was just for you.

Some team will do something really stupid just before training camps open and that will get the ball rolling league wide. Let it not be us.

Thanks Fac, but maybe you should change the final line, you do not want to alienate ALL the conservatives. How about -Time to end their system of controlling the country from the minority?

On the matter of a Mitchell trade, totally agree with this post.

[chipstern]

You are feeling good about chemistry in this team with Randle on the roster? I am asking because I would also like to believe.

I would also like to believe. 

Certainly he deserves an opportunity to play with Brunson. 

A Randle trade that made sense is not anththetical to my beliefs. 

But just bringing on a basket of shit, a trade for the sake of trade, a bunch of bodies who will be unhappy campers if they do not get minutes, taking up roster/floor space that could be better deployed by our pups. 

I DO NOT GIVE A FROZEN FUCK ABOUT RANDLE'S CONTRACT HIT, NOR FOURNEIR's. 

If a trade makes sense, hey. 

But this whole DUMP RANDLE feeding frenzy is FUCKING NONSENSICAL. 

The reason we got Brunson was to make Randle, Barrett, Fournier and Robinson BETTER. 

Would I like to see Toppin challenge Randle, Reddish challenge Barrett, Grimes challenge Fournier and Hartenstein challenge Robinson? 

YOU BET. 

RANDLE sucked so badly last season he still averaged 20-10-5.  He is a skilled player, who got all caught up in his own overheated sense of what he was expected to do, what he thought he should be doing.  Part of it was his fault.  Part of it was Thibs' deployment, setting him up to fail, as he was overtasked--has good facilitating skills but he is not a fucking point forward, that is to say we had NO FUCKING POINT GUARDS, save for my man Deuce, who was surely game, but hardly ready.  I don't think Julius was coasting on his contract, but I do believe that he overthinks the game, when he should be more straightfoward and decisive.  The Hawks playoff beat down got in his head. 

Anyway, not to make excuses for him, but to put all the onus for a sucky season is just wrong. 

We never recovered from the Kemba experiment, nor Thibs' petulant response,  and when Rose went down, let alone all of the COVID shit, we were fucked. 

I've seen internet scenarios where we were involved in a Westbrook trade where we got Tucker-Fucker and a 2027 Lakers #1, and the Lakers got Randle and Fournier.  And the Jazz got Westbrook and a load of assets from the Knicks. 

FUCK THAT. 

CAP SPACE?

FUCK THAT.  Bail out the Lakers with two talented vets for a basket of shit.  FUCK THE LAKERS. 

I appear to be saying fuck a lot. 

I apologize. 

But making trades just for the sake of trades are confounding to my tiny fucking brain. 

I am NOT OVERESTIMATING the level of talent on our roster. 

It would be a miracle if we cracked the Top Six in a rough & tumble East.   The 6-10 spots seem doable. 

Rose & Company have taken away Thibs' veteran suckling nipple, though, hey, we still have Rose, Fournier, Randle, Brunson and Robinson. 

Robinson-Randle-Barrett-Fournier-Brunson

Hartenstein-Toppin-Reddish-Grimes-Quickley

Hey, Grimes might supplant Fournier in the starting five.  Fournier might supplant Reddish on the second unit, with Quickley and Rose in the backcourt. 

McBride and Sims are going to command some playing time in a crowded rotation. 

We have depth up and down 1-through-15. 

We do NOT NEED TO ADD more fucking bodies in the name of opening up cap space. 

We do not need to GIVE AWAY Randle and Fournier. 

We do not need to gut our roster and give away all of our number 1 picks for Donovan Mitchell. 

We need to optimize and nurture and develop the young talent we have on this very competitive but admittedly green unproven roster, to build on our shared suffering and hard earned chemistry from last season, and let Jalen Brunson work his mojo as our bell cow. 

We don't need to dump Randle and Fournier.  We need to optimize their talent and set them up to succeed.  If they raise their game, they raise their value, either to the Knicks or potential sutors.  We're not trying to tank.  We're trying to GROW. 

So a garage sale? 

Come on, dude. 

Anyway, stay cool in the dog days upon us. 

[facilitatorn]

After toiling through Fizz-Miller, as the last PF standing, Randle has given us a full year of world beater and a full year of misguided talent with management, coach and the following players there throughout who will also be back this year,

Mitch Obi RJ Rose IQ

We hope with reason that we have upgraded the starting PG and reserve center while at least holding serve with the other wing and second unit filler.

The machine could be primed for a Randle resurgence, especially if he can find a groove and a lane that works for everyone.

From scant evidence it looks like he has not slacked off in his approach to improving himself, so why not give him a chance to help us be amazing and thereby win back the faithful and the Garden crowd?

[elephant]

...

Patience?  You never know what kind of tasty treat might appear on the horizon.  The Clippers cashed in when John Wall was bought out by the Rockets, and they got him for what, $6.49 million, with a team option for the second year. 

Seeing as how the Clippers have the highest payroll in the league: $195,331,757

Kawhi Leonard & Paul George: 42, 45 48 [player option]

Norman Powell: 16, 18, 19, 20

Marcus Morris: 16, 17

Luke Kennard: 13, 14, 14 [team option]

Robert Covington: 12, 11

Reggie Jackson: 11

Nicholas Batum: 10, 11

Ivica Zubac: 10, 10, 11

They are in win now mode, and teaming Wall with Jackson at PG [health wlling], a healthy Leonard and George [GOD willing], and with their veteran depth and skill set, they can make a big noise out west. 

However, because the Knicks were proactive in keeping contracts short [Burks, Noel and Rose all on 2 +1's], and thus able to maneuver to swap out draft assets for more draft assets and salary cap space, they were able to pounce on the Clippers' 24 year old center Isaiah Hartenstein right at the point where he is just starting to really peak[/b], and where the Clippers went all in on John Wall and presumably they could not afford his salary plus the luxury tax hit, which seems odd, I mean, in for a dime in for a dollar.  Still, the Knicks were able to swoop in and get him with cap space left over from their Jalen Brunson pursuit. 

This is a really interesting observation.

[kiidcarter8]

Hunt and Keels?  What?