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Warriors

1 (33.3%)

Celtics

2 (66.7%)

Total Members Voted: 3

Voting closed: June 13, 2022, 11:38:11 PM

[Kam]

Joakim leading the Grizz to a victory over AD and the Plexicans  -- in 30 minutes off the bench he contributed 19pts 14rebs and 3 assists.

Could have done just fine here if they had just put him on the court.

Which would have happened eventually.  But he felt the minutes were owed to  him... On a season he started suspended.

[elephant]

Anyone see this new film on Netflix High Flying Bird?

It's about basketball, money, race, ownership, directed by Steven Soderbergh, written by the Tarell McCraney (the dude who wrote Moonlight), has great actors and cinematography.......

But it struck me as a bore. Lots of talk, weak story, and a critique that seemed more obvious than revealing.

Wondering what others here think.

[newfan]

Why was carlos123 banned from this forum?

[kidcarter8]

Can't help you, sorry 


heh

[bodiddley]

He was usurped by czarlos345?

Yeah, something weird going on.
I was banned indefinitely yesterday, but back today.
My indefinite ban lasted about 24 hours or so.

I emailed josh the admin, but didn't hear back so don't know if that worked.  I couldn't even re-register under a different name as both my browsers showed me as banned and unable to use any function including register.  And my phone couldn't see the captcha code to finish the registration process.  Maybe if I emptied cookies  I could have registered on my PC?

[bodiddley]

KP says he won't resign, and you say the Knicks should've kept him and offered him the money to see if he really turns it down.
AD says he won't resign and you say the Pelicans should have dealt him rather than tempt him with $80 million more.
Can't have it both ways.

Different situations.
Including this season, AD has already banked $94M.
He's got a guaranteed $27M for next year.
With a player option for a further $29M.
He's looking to win as he has already has the money locked in.

KZ has made just $19M including this year.  Sure sounds like a lot, but with nearly half going to taxes, he got about $10M.  You buy a house for $1M or more, gift money to family and spend some on yourself (cars, jewelry, etc) and you could easily be down to $5M or so.  Not really a lifetime of high living. 

KZ needs to cash in.  He also has to worry about his health.  Another injury before signing a new contract would wipe away a potential $130M guaranteed max deal.  Playing on a $7M qo next year would be awfully risky for him.  Extremely unlikely that he'd take a guaranteed 1 year $7M deal instead of a guaranteed $130M deal.  So I'd call his bluff.

Also, I think the team dynamics are different.  AD has been in NO for a long time and wants out.  That kills the teams chance at the playoffs this year and next.  KZ was on a team very much in flux.   I think he could have been sold on a team built around him.  The draft and FA market this Summer would have changed things.  New coach if need be.  So many current Knix won't be back that his wanting out could be easily forgotten, and forgiving giving the losing.

Lastly, NOPe got a big legit offer, with lots of young players coming in order to rebuild.  Knix got cap space and one young player.  Chose to jettison salary and get a weak return for KZ.  If anyone offered Knix 3 good young players for KZ, I would have been interested.

So: 1) KZ needs to cash in.  Couldn't risk a one year deal given his injury (and not having had a big contract yet).  2) Team situations different.  3) NO got a reasonable offer, not the nonsense the Knix dealt for.

[bodiddley]

Banning explained:

Josh, when I tried to log in from an android last night and this a.m. I got a "banned" screen.  Looks like someone else got it, too.  Seems to be okay from this desktop.  Is there a problem with IP addresses from mobiles and tablets?

Sorry - I tried to block a ton of spammers all at once and apparently your IP was among those I caught.

I have undone that ban and will see if I can fine tune it or if I am going to have to deal with that one piecemeal.

[Kam]

Why was carlos123 banned from this forum?

Receps goons got him.

[Kam]

Anyone see this new film on Netflix High Flying Bird?

It's about basketball, money, race, ownership, directed by Steven Soderbergh, written by the Tarell McCraney (the dude who wrote Moonlight), has great actors and cinematography.......

But it struck me as a bore. Lots of talk, weak story, and a critique that seemed more obvious than revealing.

Wondering what others here think.

I just watched it.  I liked it even though it felt a little too tidy.  Like there were never any real stakes.

[Kam]

KP says he won't resign, and you say the Knicks should've kept him and offered him the money to see if he really turns it down.
AD says he won't resign and you say the Pelicans should have dealt him rather than tempt him with $80 million more.
Can't have it both ways.

Different situations.
Including this season, AD has already banked $94M.
He's got a guaranteed $27M for next year.
With a player option for a further $29M.
He's looking to win as he has already has the money locked in.

KZ has made just $19M including this year.  Sure sounds like a lot, but with nearly half going to taxes, he got about $10M.  You buy a house for $1M or more, gift money to family and spend some on yourself (cars, jewelry, etc) and you could easily be down to $5M or so.  Not really a lifetime of high living. 

KZ needs to cash in.

KZ already is set for life from his rookie deal. AND the QO would pay him more.  And even if he broke down he would still get some mid level offers for some teams.  He and his brother-wife said they don't care about the money.

[bodiddley]

$5M or $8M savings isn't really set for life, unless you want to live an upper middle class lifestyle.  It doesn't fully secure your children and grandchildren.  Plenty of players have had that much in savings and blew through it or got burned on investments or scammed or were too generous or whatnot, and wound up broke.  The Porzingises seem relatively grounded, but there are probably plenty of scams available in Latvia, especially in the more Russian eastern region.

Perhaps they don't care solely about the money, but when it comes down to another $7M or a guaranteed $130M that becomes just talk.  Posturing.  Yeah, I'd be pretty dang sure taking the $7M QO was an empty threat (especially given the injury history).
Who takes a chance on being able to go through life saying: Well, I could have earned another $125M but I took advice from my brother and then blew out my knee again.

Hell, KZ could sign a $130M max with the Knix (or another team as an RFA, with Knick matching rights) and then complain and say he wants out after another year or whatever if the Knix don't fix themselves and cater to whatever demands he has.  He could probably also engineer a sign-and-trade with the Knix as well (though I'm not up on how that stands under the new, new CBA).

[bodiddley]

NBA players live in an alternate universe.  They're empowered to the Nth degree to the point of misusing that power.
I can't keep mouthing off about my boss at work and complaining to everyone about not getting the most work or best jobs.
Do your job. You get paid. Coach controls minutes.  That's how shit works when shit works right.

Players who fancy themselves in charge of minutes are delusional.

It is an alternate universe:
1) Salary guaranteed ... for multiple years ... regardless of performance.
You have any part of that?
2) You're not making more than your boss
3) You're not one of a handful of workers who affect the company's bottom line and image.

Minutes (and rotation spot) are really all a coach controls.  And players have the power to challenge that and foment dissent. 

[bodiddley]

Look at it from KZ's POV.

1) He saw how the Knix treated a HOF player in Melo.  How they exiled and treated Noah.  How Kanter got jerked around minutes-wise and became vocally unhappy.  (all of that + KZ's departure can't make FA's that excited to come to Knickland)

2) He's seen what, 3 or 4 coaches, a 2nd management team, a few complete roster turnovers -- all in 3.5 years.  The constant roster flux combined with the way a few key vets were treated (see #1 above) doesn't exactly breed loyalty or trust.

3) Has it ever been clear what his beef was that he blew off the exit meeting with Phil?  But the result was that the Knix openly mused about trading him and fired Longstreet his personal coach.  And with the roster reshuffles he lost teammates and friends (Willy, maybe Kuz, probably others), and obviously didn't feel too connected to this version of the squad.  But moreover, didn't trust the team to do the right thing by him, the team, others.

4) Given all of that and the Knick track record of being poorly run, changing direction frequently, and losing for decades, it's understandable KZ had doubts about the direction and competence of the franchise.  I'd say the crappy trade of a franchise player confirms those suspicions about Knick ineptitude.

I still things fences could have been mended and bridges built and a long term future cemented and whatever other construction metaphors I haven't employed yet.

[bodiddley]

So the Knix had the guy who signed a 10-day contract earlier in the day take the final game-tying shot?  Sure, why not ...?

[bodiddley]

Here's the list of Knick draftees dating back to Chollie Ward and what we did with them instead of extending them.
https://hoopshype.com/2019/02/01/kristaps-porzingis-trade-analysis-new-york-knicks-second-contract/

1) in the 90's the Knicks were usually in the 18-22 range and didn't draft well.  Plus many years had no pick due to trades.

2) From 2004 on (post Sweetney 2003), the Knix drafted well, often late in the draft.  David Lee was extended one year, then sign-and-traded when he required a big contract.  Which I was fine with because his defense was awful and he got overpaid.

3) the Knix frequently flipped promising 3rd year players for aging vets:
Ariza (& Penny) for Stevie Franchise
Frye for Zach
Wil & Gallo for Melo & Billups

4) Landry FieldGoal and Shump (like Mr Lee) outperformed their draft slots, but  weren't worth their next contract.  While Jordan Hill underperformed and was no loss.

5) they should have included Nate and Jerian Grant, draft picks the Knix bought.   While Tim Jr was traded away and then brought back on a rookie extension.  So it's like the Knix gave their draftee a multi-year extension, just after trading him away for two years.

It's really Gallo, Ariza, Frye & Wil who could/should have been extended.  But the Knix were always in a hurry and wanted to bring in some big name vet to Win Now.  Never worked.