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1 (8.3%)

Total Members Voted: 11

Voting closed: February 15, 2022, 10:51:36 AM

[Hairy Lime]

Infrastructure racism. Two views.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-58106414


And...https://nypost.com/2021/08/11/bidens-infrastructure-bill-is-chock-full-of-anti-white-racism/

The solution is a problem, and the problem needs a solution.

The problem is that the journalists who write for the BBC and the creepy fucking morons hired by the post to lie badly in their publications are put on the same level by feckless idiots on the internet and elsewhere.

How do you propose to solve this problem, oh Great Cheez Whiz Hamster?

Two views. Neither endorsed. The Left Coast leftist doesn't tolerate different views.

Neither do you.  Or at least, to the extent you consistently express your view that disagreement with you is intolerance.

[Yankguy1]

Perhaps the larger problem here was your own eagerness to attack another poster, and perhaps due to your own prejudices.

Ciao, Che.

Beautiful.

[Holly Martins]

My bullshit was backed by the numbers.  Yours by unsupported bluster.   Outside donors gain undue influence on pols who should listen to their constituents.  QED.

If the pols ignore their constituents they don’t win elections.
BTW Koch is not raising money for Manchin, he is trying to pressure Manchin through grassroots support via emails on issues they both support.

Potayto,  potahto.  And you've never heard of dark money?   

Pols ignore in-district constituents,  then use out-district donor money to buy ads that persuade voters they weren't ignored and their opponent is worse.   That's what the figures show.   With enough money,  you can con your base into believing that shit  makes the best shoe polish, and you've been busy shining their shoes.   It works because most people don't factcheck.  Or remember what Joe Shmo promised last time.  Democracy barely has a pulse ATM.

[Hairy Lime]

I didn’t think anyone could annoy me as much as Joe Manchin... then along came Gottheimer.

Damned if these “Moderates” aren’t doing their best to fuck things up.

They won’t succeed but sheesh! At least act like you give a damn about the voters that put you in the majority.

And you'd rather just keep printing Monopoly money.

Got it.

Why not? The risk is inflation, and that can be limited by taking money out of the system if necessary.

[Hairy Lime]

No you don’t.

The cost of these programs is easily covered by even a remotely responsible tax code and endorsement regime, part and parcel of better budget, which Smokey Joe Manchin needs to get his ass behind.

No. They're not.

Yes they are. That is why it can go through the reconciliation process.

[Holly Martins]

Los Estados Unidos!

Latinos drove the country’s demographic growth, shooting up to 62.1 million, the Census Bureau announced Thursday....

Soccer soon replaces football.

And Americans grow handsomer and more melanoma-resistant,  so what?   Is there a point in there,  Nate-Bed?   

[Holly Martins]

No you don’t.

The cost of these programs is easily covered by even a remotely responsible tax code and endorsement regime, part and parcel of better budget, which Smokey Joe Manchin needs to get his ass behind.

No. They're not.

Yes they are. That is why it can go through the reconciliation process.

I marvel at the propaganda machines that are convincing people that these programs aren't paid for.  By returning to a normal taxation system instead of trump's welfare-for-billionaires. 

[Hairy Lime]

If you are revitalizing infrastructure, and as a small fraction of that investment you can correct engineering decisions that perpetrate immense tragic societal ills, you do it both morally and fiscally. Rebuilding cities to better suit the understood needs of their populations every few generations is a hallmark of civilizations that haven’t collapsed. If rerouting certain roads reduces hospitalization and incarceration in densely populated areas, spend big now so those savings can be realized going forward all the time until you need to do it again.

If you are hiring to revitalize infrastructure, you are managing streams of wealth and income to get it done. If you recognize systemic factors leading to de facto racial preferences in contracting, making it you policy to counteract that in your contracting choices is both good politics and good policy.

Austerity, denial of racism, sexism, insurrection, and anti-vaccine propaganda are all one great circle under Koch.

If one believes in true equality, let the best bid win---don't base it on the race of the bidder, simply because decisions based upon race are inherently racist.

I have no issues with how the roads are built as far as where they go, or how the local neighborhoods that will be effected are compensated for their inconveniences---as traditionally Eminent Domain comes into play.

How.were.the communities and neighborhoods divided by the interstates in the first place compensated for their inconvenience? The owners of the property were compensated, but the neighborhood?

[REDSTATEWARD]

My bullshit was backed by the numbers.  Yours by unsupported bluster.   Outside donors gain undue influence on pols who should listen to their constituents.  QED.

If the pols ignore their constituents they don’t win elections.
BTW Koch is not raising money for Manchin, he is trying to pressure Manchin through grassroots support via emails on issues they both support.

Potayto,  potahto.  And you've never heard of dark money?   

Pols ignore in-district constituents, 

Pols can’t ignore in-District constituents.  Pols are employed by those very peopl.

then use out-district donor money to buy ads that persuade voters they weren't ignored and their opponent is worse.That's what the figures show.With enough money,  you can con your base into believing that shit  makes the best shoe polish, and you've been busy shining their shoes.   It works because most people don't factcheck.

A child of five might understand you.  Send me a child of five to talk to.
( My favorite Marx quote)

[Hairy Lime]

I didn’t think anyone could annoy me as much as Joe Manchin... then along came Gottheimer.

Damned if these “Moderates” aren’t doing their best to fuck things up.

They won’t succeed but sheesh! At least act like you give a damn about the voters that put you in the majority.

And you'd rather just keep printing Monopoly money.

Got it.

Nope.

It’s called investing in America’s future.

Not if you can't pay for it. Fixing roads and bridges and tunnels is a great thing. Still, one should only invest with money one has., or with what can reasonably earn back to pay.  There are always ways to leverage debt, of course, but there is also something called "too much debt".

Joe Manchin and others are right to question to the level of that debt.

Your view seems to indicate that you would call a credit card use an investment, it seems.

That's not how it works.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yq_E3HquRJY

[Hairy Lime]

http://theweek.com/politics/1003600/anti-vaxxers-coddling

Good policy and good politics to squash these fucks.

Agree.

But libs need to kick POC'S asses into gear, too.

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/black-people-remain-undervaccinated-may-180000759.html

‘Blame (whitey) black people, that’s what you do.”

LOL

Behave as expected. From that piece on yahoo, "According to USA Today, Black people count for 15 percent of those vaccinated in the United States."

Go ahead and defend that response. Oh, that's right. You can't. Yet, you imply racism for mentioning the facts. There is no way that 85% of black folks are not vaxed due to  "inaccessibility".

Blacks accounting for 15% of the vaccinated population does not mean 85% are unvaccinated. Blacks are not 100% of the population.
According to the last estimate I can find from the Census Bureau blacks are 13.4% of the population, so if they are 15% of the vaccinated population they are getting vaccinated at a higher rate that the population at large.

[Hairy Lime]

Dominion has a defamation case going against Giuliani, Powell, and Lindell (Pillow Guy). The three moved to get it stopped on the basis that opinions are not defamatory.

The judge denied their motion:
https://twitter.com/JanNWolfe/status/1425852428612685824

The judge shredded Sidney Powell's argument that she was merely opining, and that no reasonable person could think she was asserting facts. (2/10)
...
The judge recited a bunch of Sidney Powell's more outlandish claims, like that Dominion was founded to ensure Hugo Chavez stays in power. The judge said of course this is an assertion of fact, not opinion. It's either true, or it's not.
...
Sidney Powell argued -- and I quote her brief directly --  that her claims about Dominion "are not actionable because they were made in the context of pending and impending litigation."

The judge said: no, a law license isn't a license to make stuff up. (4/10)
...
Similar energy in this footnote regarding Giuliani. The judge seems to be signaling he knows how flimsy these election conspiracy theories are.

"The Venezuela theory presumably finds its roots in the Venezuelan origins of Smartmatic, a different company." (6/10)

Etc.

I cannot wait until they sue Cyber Ninjas.

[Hairy Lime]

I didn’t think anyone could annoy me as much as Joe Manchin... then along came Gottheimer.

Damned if these “Moderates” aren’t doing their best to fuck things up.

They won’t succeed but sheesh! At least act like you give a damn about the voters that put you in the majority.

Is Gottheimer one of the Problem Solvers?   

Politicians answer now to their donors,  not their constituents (who usually only are a tiny percent of donors these days).

If that were true( which I doubt)..

Not looking for what people doubt, but some facts.  Here is some indication of what I was actually talking about....

Median percent in-district among current candidates: 28.87%

https://www.opensecrets.org/elections-overview/in-district-vs-out-of-district

(and I've seen analyses that give even lower figures for in-district donation, with the percent of total monetary amount even lower when you compute it that way....)

My point (which was about Congress, specifically, if you read the post) is that outside donors may have different agendas (like the Koch foundation policy papers that Joe Manchin receives along with his bags of money from them...) from the actual constituents.  This is a problem in both parties and all coalitions in those parties, which should concern all of us, regardless of our politics. 

I wasn't, as you allege, "ignoring" smaller donors, but pointing out that, on average, too many of them are from outside that congressional district (or state, in the case of senators).

LOL
You are mad at Manchin and don’t like the Koch Foundation.
Why didn’t you just say that?
All the rest was just bullshit.

My bullshit was backed by the numbers.  Yours by unsupported bluster.   Outside donors gain undue influence on pols who should listen to their constituents.  QED.

If the pols ignore their constituents they don’t win elections.

Excellent.  Monmouth and Quinnipiac polls in the last month put support for the 3.5 trillion dollar reconciliation infrastructure plan at 62 and 63 percent nationally. So, listen to those polls Manchin and Sinema!

"Oh, those polls!"

[Holly Martins]

According to the last estimate I can find from the Census Bureau blacks are 13.4% of the population, so if they are 15% of the vaccinated population they are getting vaccinated at a higher rate that the population at large.

Josh and I both pointed out this math difficulty.  I'm sure he'll concede the point.

[REDSTATEWARD]

If you are revitalizing infrastructure, and as a small fraction of that investment you can correct engineering decisions that perpetrate immense tragic societal ills, you do it both morally and fiscally. Rebuilding cities to better suit the understood needs of their populations every few generations is a hallmark of civilizations that haven’t collapsed. If rerouting certain roads reduces hospitalization and incarceration in densely populated areas, spend big now so those savings can be realized going forward all the time until you need to do it again.

If you are hiring to revitalize infrastructure, you are managing streams of wealth and income to get it done. If you recognize systemic factors leading to de facto racial preferences in contracting, making it you policy to counteract that in your contracting choices is both good politics and good policy.

Austerity, denial of racism, sexism, insurrection, and anti-vaccine propaganda are all one great circle under Koch.

If one believes in true equality, let the best bid win---don't base it on the race of the bidder, simply because decisions based upon race are inherently racist.

I have no issues with how the roads are built as far as where they go, or how the local neighborhoods that will be effected are compensated for their inconveniences---as traditionally Eminent Domain comes into play.

How.were.the communities and neighborhoods divided by the interstates in the first place compensated for their inconvenience? The owners of the property were compensated, but the neighborhood?

Werent the business owners, landlords or private home owners compensated under eminent domain?
How would renters be compensated?