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Very

6 (50%)

Some

4 (33.3%)

Not sure

0 (0%)

Not really

1 (8.3%)

Not in the slightest

1 (8.3%)

Total Members Voted: 11

Voting closed: February 15, 2022, 10:51:36 AM

[josh]

Ward is censoring my posts!

(This is sarcasm.)

[josh]

I will try to go back to reconstruct my destructed post, but here are few relevant links from it:

The actual survey release, which still doesn't include the instrument, but is far better than the pap from the president of Herzog.
https://herzogfoundation.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/HF_Data_Memo_210804.pdf

This is an example of how parents felt about public vs charter vs private schools BC (before Covid):
https://www.educationnext.org/results-parents-survey-2016-poll-interactive/

More to be said about the opinion piece by Mr. Graves in a bit.

[Holly Martins]

Oh,  no doubt it's a push poll from a group strongly biased specifically towards Christian schools,  but as I said,  even if we take the writer's interpretation at face value,  it still doesn't make the point it thinks it's making.   ALL private schools,  regardless of religious or secular leaning,  have higher parental satisfaction.   It's like saying homeowners who custom-built their houses show higher floor plan satisfaction.

It is odd that the writer wouldn't link the actual poll,  given that he's chairman of the Herzog Fndn.   

[REDSTATEWARD]

The trees are hiding the forest from Barton.

[josh]

Barton, the piece on Herzog's own site has the link. I don't know why the release to the public did not or in his Real Clear Schools version, given that other links were maintained. Perhaps it is because the "data memo" from the polling firm makes it clear how biased an instrument it was.

It is an opinion piece, as was obvious to the Fairfield Sun Times, who printed it:
https://www.fairfieldsuntimes.com/opinion/christian-schools-vastly-outperforming-public-schools-during-covid-19-according-to-new-survey-of-parents/article_57350180-7fb4-5b84-8d81-b5c775feaddd.html

The mission of Herzog is to promote Christian schools. This survey was crafted to do that and to promote conservative values (and claims) at the same time.

And how the survey was shaped to get the results they wanted can be seen from how these questions were phrased:

Parents do not want to their children taught radical social positions incongruent with reality.

70% of all parents do not want their children taught that White people are inherently privileged, while Black and other people are inherently oppressed and victimized.

80% of all parents do not want their children taught that achieving racial justice and equality between racial groups requires discriminating against people based on their Whiteness.

[josh]

In this set of survey results on school preferences and thoughts from 2016, we get a pretty clear picture about who is choosing, what they are choosing, and to a limited extent why they are choosing it:
https://nces.ed.gov/programs/schoolchoice/ind_08.asp

My favorite stat is figure 8.5 in which we see that 54% of parents with kids in assigned public schools were very satisfied with their schools, while 77% of private school parents were satisfied. Individual details follow.

This compares to the 55% of public school parents satisfied and 80% of Christian school parents satisfied from the Herzog survey. Obviously the language is slightly different, but the NCES survey also is not using a quite so preselected population for the private school parents.

Last point that I made in my truncated post:

The 25% had schools not close vs. 8% had schools not close fails to consider two points as presented by Mr. Graves:

1) There is no reason to believe that school closures were worse for the kids overall than not, even granting that education was delayed for many kids. Yes, worse for some kids, but better for others, as has been amply demonstrated - and safer for families.

2) The LAWS were different in different places. Not everywhere that shut down their public schools even tried to shut down their religious schools. Somehow, painting that as a problem with the schools seems asinine.

[FlyingVProd]

I met a gentleman in Rome, Italy, who was a retired school teacher from New York City, he retired and he moved to Rome and he opened his own Irish Pub in Rome. He said that at first he hated working as a public high school teacher, and he said he actually feared for his life, and then he quit, and then he went to work teaching at a Catholic high school, and all of  a sudden he loved teaching and the students really wanted to learn. He loved teaching at a Catholic high school.

Salute,

Tony V.

[facilitatorn]

How old do you think Red was when they finally kicked him out of public school for being such a terribly bad person?

[facilitatorn]

http://m.dailykos.com/stories/2021/8/28/2045814/-Supreme-Court-Bar-Judge-Blasts-Roberts-amp-Warns-about-Radical-Right-s-Plans

[facilitatorn]

http://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/08/28/on-voting-rights-what-would-mlk-do-507044

King was right about moderates

[FlyingVProd]

The Catholics are marching today globally in support of the women of Afghanistan, and in support of the people of Afghanistan. 

https://cruxnow.com/church-in-asia/2021/08/economy-of-francesco-calls-for-solidarity-with-afghan-women/

Salute,

Tony V.

[facilitatorn]

http://www.salon.com/2021/08/28/evangelicals-science-and-the-vaccine-refusal-is-built-on-deep-seated-fear/

[facilitatorn]

http://www.theguardian.com/education/2021/aug/28/harvard-university-chief-chaplain-atheist

Good news on the religion front

Harvard has the right idea

[bodiddley]

Parents do not want to their children taught radical social positions incongruent with reality.

Except for Christian mythology...

I always thought in the case of Afghanistan or Iraq or just helping a poor country such as Haiti, some of the best aid is to simply give everyone, or everyone poor $1000.  They can then decide how best to spend it to help their families.  The good thing about getting money to poor people is they have definite needs and so spend the money circulating it in the local economy.  Also, an argument for increasing the minimum wage in the US.  And if you're worried about poor people spending the money too quickly or rampant inflation, you can always give say $250 in cash, and a bank account with $750, and can even restrict withdrawal to $300 a year or whatever.  Seems a much better method than flying in planeloads of cash and then having elites and gov't officials fly that much of that same cash out of the country.  Helping poor people directly with cash would seem to have lots of benefits and avoid lots of evils.  Has to be better than spending billions on bombs.

[REDSTATEWARD]

Giving money to poor people only creates one certainty.
There will be a lot of poor people