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4 (33.3%)

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0 (0%)

Not really

1 (8.3%)

Not in the slightest

1 (8.3%)

Total Members Voted: 11

Voting closed: February 15, 2022, 10:51:36 AM

[josh]

It's a simple, utopian idea. If we give everyone a monthly check, we can eliminate poverty and do away with the inefficiencies of our cumbersome and flawed welfare state. Minneapolis is the latest city to give a “universal basic income” (UBI) a try. It's offering $500 a month for 18 months to 150 of its low-income residents with no work or spending restrictions.

But others worry it's not so simple. A universal basic income would be expensive, and what if it discourages people to work, which could inadvertently increase inequality and lead to social instability? A new paper suggests the skeptics may be right: UBI may cause more harm than good for a very high cost.

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2021-07-16/would-a-universal-basic-income-work-for-gen-z?utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&utm_term=210716&utm_campaign=sharetheview

Thus far, none of the research has supported that supposition.

That doesn't mean it won't change, but the evidence goes the other way.

But even more than that, we don't need everybody to work for us to have enough for everybody to eat, have shelter, etc.

This was declared more than 50 years ago and it is far more true today than it was then. It's one of the simple truths that make capitalism perhaps less called for than the capitalists would like.

Assuming we survive our climate issues, there will not be enough jobs for everybody in this country to work. Cheaper energy is one of the main reasons for this. Efficiency of operation is another. Automation that takes advantage of the first and feeds into the second is the third.

People need something to do, probably, but "work" for pay may well not be among them

Sure. No one needs to work when you create a system of DEPENDING on government assistance.

You’d be surprised how many enterprising and entrepreneurial efforts will be unleashed in people who aren’t just scuffling to survive.
 

If and only if he could actually accept it.

And even then, he would never say so here.

[josh]

[LarryBnDC]

Kyrsten Sinema is who MLK is talking about.

She called John Lewis her personal hero yesterday while being a stumbling block to the legislation that would cement the legacy of his life’s work.







"First, I must confess that over the last few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can't agree with your methods of direct action;" who paternalistically feels he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by the myth of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a "more convenient season."

Shallow understanding from people of goodwill is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection."

[josh]

"Delta variant is so contagious, the unprotected will likely get it, Trump FDA chief says"

Boy, all those Chicken Littles from across the political spectrum.

Couldn't possibly be that they are onto something, huh?!

[josh]

Hundreds of cars lined up along Hwy 18 into Mission, South Dakota as the remains of Native children were returned to their homelands.

[facilitatorn]

But if you truly follow the science of Climate Change alarmists of your ilk aren’t making much sense.

I used to think you were either dishonest or stupid.   Then I realized it was both.   

Facebook and QAnon sites are not reliable sources of scientific information.

I wonder if Red believes the moronic things he posts, as I'm not sure he's as stupid as he portrays himself to be, and he's just trolling away. But I can't rule out stupidity is the shaky platform Red stands upon.

But Red is clearly dishonest.

Red is a shill.

Red is a shill who parrots a malignant narcissist with rapidly advancing dementia.

Red is a malignant narcissist who parrots a shill with rapidly advancing dementia.

[facilitatorn]

http://www.salon.com/2021/07/17/how-evangelicals-abandoned-christianity--and-became-conservatives-instead-3/

[Hamilton Samuels]

”Tell us, Larry, if she were still here today, would you still beat your wife?


FUN stuff.”


You are literally a slag heap of human excrement.

But next time I go to the Cathedral I’m going to light a candle for you.

Hey, it was EXACTLY the same kind of  "argument" that was made by you to justify the label racist.

No.

Nothing at all.

Then we agree to disagree.

[Hamilton Samuels]

It's a simple, utopian idea. If we give everyone a monthly check, we can eliminate poverty and do away with the inefficiencies of our cumbersome and flawed welfare state. Minneapolis is the latest city to give a “universal basic income” (UBI) a try. It's offering $500 a month for 18 months to 150 of its low-income residents with no work or spending restrictions.

But others worry it's not so simple. A universal basic income would be expensive, and what if it discourages people to work, which could inadvertently increase inequality and lead to social instability? A new paper suggests the skeptics may be right: UBI may cause more harm than good for a very high cost.

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2021-07-16/would-a-universal-basic-income-work-for-gen-z?utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&utm_term=210716&utm_campaign=sharetheview

Thus far, none of the research has supported that supposition.

That doesn't mean it won't change, but the evidence goes the other way.

But even more than that, we don't need everybody to work for us to have enough for everybody to eat, have shelter, etc.

This was declared more than 50 years ago and it is far more true today than it was then. It's one of the simple truths that make capitalism perhaps less called for than the capitalists would like.

Assuming we survive our climate issues, there will not be enough jobs for everybody in this country to work. Cheaper energy is one of the main reasons for this. Efficiency of operation is another. Automation that takes advantage of the first and feeds into the second is the third.

People need something to do, probably, but "work" for pay may well not be among them

Sure. No one needs to work when you create a system of DEPENDING on government assistance.

You’d be surprised how many enterprising and entrepreneurial efforts will be unleashed in people who aren’t just scuffling to survive.
 

No, I wouldn't. Some people will respond that way. Some.
 But maybe you didn't read the piece.

Our current welfare system is imperfect. But the fact that it makes payments contingent on earnings, age or even having a child is a better alternative. First of all, it's much cheaper because you don’t have to give money to the many people who don’t need it. Second, guaranteed money (or money you get no matter what happens) is worth much more than income that only pays off some of the time. The more money we give people, the bigger impact it will have on their behavior, and often not in a good way.

One issue with the recent lottery study is that it only tracks winners for several years. Many lottery winners think the windfall will set them up for life, but they end up filing for bankruptcy and are then prone to depression and bad health (which is why you should always take the annuity option). But this demonstrates the challenges of implementing UBI. Once it's offered, it's very difficult to take it away, and doing so can leave people worse off than they started.

[Hamilton Samuels]

Kyrsten Sinema is who MLK is talking about.

She called John Lewis her personal hero yesterday while being a stumbling block to the legislation that would cement the legacy of his life’s work.







"First, I must confess that over the last few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can't agree with your methods of direct action;" who paternalistically feels he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by the myth of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a "more convenient season."

Shallow understanding from people of goodwill is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection."

So, MLK generalized about people based in the race and their politics.

Not the inclusive guy we build statues and name boulevards for, was he?

[Hamilton Samuels]

BLM Matters:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2021/07/19/stone-manning-eco-terrorism-biden-must-pull-blm-nomination/7980898002/

[Hamilton Samuels]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/inside-the-trump-organization-money-mans-interview-with-investigators

A mess.

[josh]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/inside-the-trump-organization-money-mans-interview-with-investigators

A mess.

I don't buy some of his "defense."

Like his claim that at the time he probably didn't know that he couldn't use foundation money to pay for a different organization's fine - separation of funds of a non-profit from the for-profit businesses is a pretty basic accounting principle.

[LarryBnDC]

”Tell us, Larry, if she were still here today, would you still beat your wife?


FUN stuff.”


You are literally a slag heap of human excrement.

But next time I go to the Cathedral I’m going to light a candle for you.

Hey, it was EXACTLY the same kind of  "argument" that was made by you to justify the label racist.

No.

Nothing at all.

Then we agree to disagree.

No.

I don’t agree to anything.

You’re wrong.

[josh]

I don't know whose idea it was to have the Olympic athletes hang out with the Texas Democrats, but it really didn't goal well for either group.