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Total Members Voted: 11

Voting closed: February 15, 2022, 10:51:36 AM

[josh]

Nuclear is a carbon free renewable.

So, in the US, carbon-based fuels provide ~60% of our energy, not 80%, as you erroneously stated.

Good of you to admit it.

The fact remains no matter what part of the world you are in we need more Natural gas and other carbon fuels, plus nuclear,  to meet growing demand.  Solar and Wind are no longer viable.

It's as if you blew right past all those countries that are increasingly less dependent upon the carbon fuels.

Solar is more viable than it has ever been, with increasingly efficient solar cells and spreading capability.

Whatever weed you are smoking, you should taper off. Or, if you are relying on your energy stocks and fretful of their term utility, relax. EM in the early first year of six a $15 billion investment in lower greenhouse gas emission initiatives. Shell picked up almost half of Silicon Ranch a while ago and all of Savion last year, in addition to expanding their own sustainable energy capacity. BP picked up 7X Energy last summer.

You and your share of the troglodyte wing of the GOP seem to be the only ones who believe "solar ... is no longer viable."

Wind? Other than yours, McConnell's, McCarthy's and the MAGA-ites, opinions on this run in opposition, as well. Everybody's in on wind investment, too.

Part of how to reduce the vulnerability to heat wave induced wind reduction would be to have a network that is not isolated from the rest of the grid.

I listed a few of the countries in which more than 40% of their energy is coming from renewables. Their percentage has been increasing. I guess, according to you, they are not "part of the world."

"There is a growing mismatch between societal demands for action on climate change and the actual pace of progress, with energy demand and carbon emissions growing at their fastest rate for years. The world is on an unsustainable path."

~ Spencer Dale, BP chief economist, 2019.

Which is why the big oil companies are working to shift to sustainable energy production as fast as they can and so are most developed countries' governments.

[Holly Martins]

More facts to counter the lies:

Average cost per kwh in US - 14.92

South Dakota (with one of highest portions of electricity produced from renewables) - 12.62

CA is high, around 27, due to size, geography, and wildfire prevalence.  Not because of using renewables.  This was easy to research.  27:15 is not "8 times the US average."

As we see with Plains states like Nebraska, SD, and Texas, with large and growing wind installations, renewables actually bring rates down.  And will continue to do so, with subsidies and tax incentives and innovation on battery and gravity storage. 

Investors, smart money, will continue to back the growth of renewables while Ward continues to spew Far Right lies and distortions. 

Biggest LOL BTW for his lumping Boris Johnson in with "the Left."  People form the weirdest impressions while spelunking through their own colons.

[Espnthree]

Josh. 

Name one country in the EU that is not running low on energy.
Name one country in the EU whose citizens are NOT facing economic hardships brought about by higher ( much higher) electric bills.
And then tell us why the USA should REDUCE its reliance on natural gas? ( a resource we have more of than any country in the world.)
In the last 30 years we tried transitioning  to wind and solar and it has done next to nothing in reducing green house gases. We have, however, had much better success in lowering pollution by moving from Coal  to Natural Gas.
Only the Moron in Chief seems not to have noticed.

[bambu.]

Ms Pelosi will be visiting Taiwan on her Asian trip....confirmed
China has threatened to shoot down her plane if she does.

[FlyingVProd]

There have been instances in the past when we have worked together with the United Nations, and with China, to help people, with all of us working together as equals as a team, and one instance was in the Democratic Republic of the Congo. The Congo could never benefit from their resources and from Tourism because they were always fighting among themselves. So, the United Nations sent teams into the Congo to make peace, and the Chinese helped the world to make peace in the Congo. We need to work together as a team with the United Nations and with China on becoming a better planet. And we need to find the issues that we agree on that we can work together on instead of fighting and killing each other over our differences.

Salute,

Tony V.

[FlyingVProd]

Ms Pelosi will be visiting Taiwan on her Asian trip....confirmed
China has threatened to shoot down her plane if she does.

Pelosi already made the trip to Taiwan and no one was shot down. Pelosi should have flown straight to China for peace talks after she left Taiwan. There are things that we agree on with China that we can be working together on, such as saving the world economy, and feeding the starving people. Also, maybe China can help on the issue of Ukraine. I also want for China to buy orange juice from California, etc.

We need peace and prosperity. China wants money, and we need for peace to be prosperous.

Someone from high up in our government needs to go have a meeting with the Chinese in China to discuss mutual interests. We need to make peace over what we agree on instead of going to war over our differences.

Salute,

Tony V.

[josh]

Josh. 

Name one country in the EU that is not running low on energy.
Name one country in the EU whose citizens are NOT facing economic hardships brought about by higher ( much higher) electric bills.
And then tell us why the USA should REDUCE its reliance on natural gas? ( a resource we have more of than any country in the world.)
In the last 30 years we tried transitioning  to wind and solar and it has done next to nothing in reducing green house gases. We have, however, had much better success in lowering pollution by moving from Coal  to Natural Gas.
Only the Moron in Chief seems not to have noticed.

Red herrings are us.

Russia has cut off the natural gas it was supply to the EU.

This is not a problem of renewables vs. carbon-based energy origin, but of war. Oddly enough, the last time there was a war in Europe of this size or larger, they had energy shortages, too!

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/29/world/europe/russia-europe-energy-gas.html
https://archive.ph/TvZjO
With Russia using energy as leverage, the quest in many parts of Europe is to shrink demand.

However, sure.

Finland and Sweden are not low on energy.

Finland used to get about 10% of their electricity from Russia, but Russia cut it off in May. Finland has increased their imports from Sweden as well as their own output. They expect to be energy independent next year.

Sweden is a net exporter of energy, as noted wrt Finland. They are impacted by the Russian shutoff of gas, but not as much as most of Europe.

But the basis of your argument is morally bankrupt.

It's not a failure of solar or wind. It's a combination of WAR, you asshole, and failure to invest enough in solar.

[Espnthree]

Biggest LOL BTW for his lumping Boris Johnson in with "the Left." 
[People form the weirdest impressions while spelunking through their own colons.

I lumped Johnson in with the failed EU leaders who had no plan to deal with energy problem.
Fast forward to Biden if you want another example of a pathetic lame duck.

[Holly Martins]

Notice how he skipped the main body of the post rebutting his lies about renewables.  And skipped Josh's inconvenient facts, too. 

More facts to counter the lies:

Average cost per kwh in US - 14.92

South Dakota (with one of highest portions of electricity produced from renewables) - 12.62

CA is high, around 27, due to size, geography, and wildfire prevalence.  Not because of using renewables.  This was easy to research.  27:15 is not "8 times the US average."

As we see with Plains states like Nebraska, SD, and Texas, with large and growing wind installations, renewables actually bring rates down.  And will continue to do so, with subsidies and tax incentives and innovation on battery and gravity storage. 

Investors, smart money, will continue to back the growth of renewables while Ward continues to spew Far Right lies and distortions. 

Biggest LOL BTW for his lumping Boris Johnson in with "the Left."  People form the weirdest impressions while spelunking through their own colons.

[Espnthree]

Josh. 

Name one country in the EU that is not running low on energy.
Name one country in the EU whose citizens are NOT facing economic hardships brought about by higher ( much higher) electric bills.
And then tell us why the USA should REDUCE its reliance on natural gas? ( a resource we have more of than any country in the world.)
In the last 30 years we tried transitioning  to wind and solar and it has done next to nothing in reducing green house gases. We have, however, had much better success in lowering pollution by moving from Coal  to Natural Gas.
Only the Moron in Chief seems not to have noticed.

Red herrings are us.

Russia has cut off the natural gas it was supply to the EU.

This is not a problem of renewables vs. carbon-based energy origin, but of war. Oddly enough, the last time there was a war in Europe of this size or larger, they had energy shortages, too!

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/29/world/europe/russia-europe-energy-gas.html
https://archive.ph/TvZjO

Are you fucking serious?  Punish the People!
How about you get heat every other day?
Is that reducing demand in your fucked up world. ?

[

[josh]

Josh. 

Name one country in the EU that is not running low on energy.
Name one country in the EU whose citizens are NOT facing economic hardships brought about by higher ( much higher) electric bills.
And then tell us why the USA should REDUCE its reliance on natural gas? ( a resource we have more of than any country in the world.)
In the last 30 years we tried transitioning  to wind and solar and it has done next to nothing in reducing green house gases. We have, however, had much better success in lowering pollution by moving from Coal  to Natural Gas.
Only the Moron in Chief seems not to have noticed.

Red herrings are us.

Russia has cut off the natural gas it was supply to the EU.

This is not a problem of renewables vs. carbon-based energy origin, but of war. Oddly enough, the last time there was a war in Europe of this size or larger, they had energy shortages, too!

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/29/world/europe/russia-europe-energy-gas.html
https://archive.ph/TvZjO

Are you fucking serious?  Punish the People!
How about you get heat every other day?
Is that reducing demand in your fucked up world. ?

[

You asked for examples of EU countries not running low on energy.

I named two.

You, of course, ignored it.

And you keep pretending the problems Europe has with energy are somehow from failures of renewables.

You pretend to be serious, but instead you are spurious.

[Espnthree]

Josh. 

Name one country in the EU that is not running low on energy.
Name one country in the EU whose citizens are NOT facing economic hardships brought about by higher ( much higher) electric bills.
And then tell us why the USA should REDUCE its reliance on natural gas? ( a resource we have more of than any country in the world.)
In the last 30 years we tried transitioning  to wind and solar and it has done next to nothing in reducing green house gases. We have, however, had much better success in lowering pollution by moving from Coal  to Natural Gas.
Only the Moron in Chief seems not to have noticed.

Red herrings are us.

Russia has cut off the natural gas it was supply to the EU.

This is not a problem of renewables vs. carbon-based energy origin, but of war. Oddly enough, the last time there was a war in Europe of this size or larger, they had energy shortages, too!

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/29/world/europe/russia-europe-energy-gas.html
https://archive.ph/TvZjO

Are you fucking serious?  Punish the People!
How about you get heat every other day?
Is that reducing demand in your fucked up world. ?

[

You asked for examples of EU countries not running low on energy.

I named two.

You, of course, ignored it.

And you keep pretending the problems Europe has with energy are somehow from failures of renewables.

You pretend to be serious, but instead you are spurious.

How could I ignore your answer that is disgustlinng embarrassing to real human beings.?
Jesus Josh do you have anything close to a moral compass?

[josh]

Josh. 

Name one country in the EU that is not running low on energy.
Name one country in the EU whose citizens are NOT facing economic hardships brought about by higher ( much higher) electric bills.
And then tell us why the USA should REDUCE its reliance on natural gas? ( a resource we have more of than any country in the world.)
In the last 30 years we tried transitioning  to wind and solar and it has done next to nothing in reducing green house gases. We have, however, had much better success in lowering pollution by moving from Coal  to Natural Gas.
Only the Moron in Chief seems not to have noticed.

Red herrings are us.

Russia has cut off the natural gas it was supply to the EU.

This is not a problem of renewables vs. carbon-based energy origin, but of war. Oddly enough, the last time there was a war in Europe of this size or larger, they had energy shortages, too!

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/29/world/europe/russia-europe-energy-gas.html
https://archive.ph/TvZjO

Are you fucking serious?  Punish the People!
How about you get heat every other day?
Is that reducing demand in your fucked up world. ?

[

You asked for examples of EU countries not running low on energy.

I named two.

You, of course, ignored it.

And you keep pretending the problems Europe has with energy are somehow from failures of renewables.

You pretend to be serious, but instead you are spurious.

How could I ignore your answer that is disgustlinng embarrassing to real human beings.?
Jesus Josh do you have anything close to a moral compass?

I point out that your response ignoring war lacked morality and an hour later you cleverly accuse me of having no moral compass.

I answer your demand about the EU and you ignore it - then pretend that by my answering YOUR FUCKING QUESTION I am somehow lacking morality.

Don't ask questions if you don't want answers.

And place blame where it belongs: Vladimir Putin, not any of the other leaders you named.

No war, no energy issues in Europe at the moment.

Grow a spine, Ward, and learn to just admit when you are wrong instead of trying everything to avoid it that you can.

Here's a sample of what you could have said, if you were being honest:

Okay, so there are countries in the EU that are not short of energy at the moment. And yes, Putin is why any EU countries are short. But even so, it doesn't change that the renewables were not capable of picking up the slack!


Lastly, stop pretending you care what happens to the poor in Europe when there is no evidence you care about the poor in the US or anywhere else unless they provide a useful talking point or bludgeon for a discussion.

Nobody is fooled. Not even Kid.

[facilitatorn]

Notice how he skipped the main body of the post rebutting his lies about renewables.  And skipped Josh's inconvenient facts, too. 

More facts to counter the lies:

Average cost per kwh in US - 14.92

South Dakota (with one of highest portions of electricity produced from renewables) - 12.62

CA is high, around 27, due to size, geography, and wildfire prevalence.  Not because of using renewables.  This was easy to research.  27:15 is not "8 times the US average."

As we see with Plains states like Nebraska, SD, and Texas, with large and growing wind installations, renewables actually bring rates down.  And will continue to do so, with subsidies and tax incentives and innovation on battery and gravity storage. 

Investors, smart money, will continue to back the growth of renewables while Ward continues to spew Far Right lies and distortions. 

Biggest LOL BTW for his lumping Boris Johnson in with "the Left."  People form the weirdest impressions while spelunking through their own colons.

Ward seems off his meds. News must be leaking into his bubble.

[facilitatorn]

There are emerging and competing grid and storage paradigms that will tie together renewable collection to meet the needs of our growing societys growing demand for power.

Doing the work to reduce inefficient demand in existing structures like homes and workplaces is a good focus while some set of tech proves its viability and reliability in the field at which time it can be spun up to scale.

If we do not let the idiots kill us all, we might be in line for a beautiful future.