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Author Topic: Major League Baseball  (Read 99952 times)

Hairy Lime

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3150 on: April 14, 2020, 09:16:47 AM »

Well, the question is if they'd still go ahead if the union vote is YES but 20% of the players say no and will opt to stay home.

My guess is sure - just wondering how much of a pay cut they decide on for each player.
You think 20% of baseball players do not want/need the paycheck?

Hasn't the union already signed off on what ownership decides?

I am curious about the minors.
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kiidcarter8

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3151 on: April 14, 2020, 01:24:26 PM »

Need?  Absolutely.  Want - is another story.
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kiidcarter8

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3152 on: April 14, 2020, 01:26:33 PM »

As for the minors - this crisis actually plays into the commissioner's hands - he was looking to shorten the draft - and eliminate all minor leagues below AA - allowing independent leagues to become the new low minors.
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josh

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3153 on: April 14, 2020, 08:22:04 PM »

RIP Hank Steinbrenner.
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josh

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The day Richard Nixon failed to answer that subpoena is the day he was subject to impeachment because he took the power from Congress over the impeachment process away from Congress, and he became the judge and jury." ~Lindsey Graham

kiidcarter8

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3155 on: April 17, 2020, 10:16:37 PM »

If no Palmeiro, no Bonds
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josh

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3156 on: April 18, 2020, 06:12:41 PM »

If no Palmeiro, no Bonds

They don't mind Palmeiro, but his numbers were not as strong for the Hall to start with - Bonds would have been in the Hall without every doing steroids.

Bonds was better off steroids than anybody else off them and better on them than anybody on them.
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The day Richard Nixon failed to answer that subpoena is the day he was subject to impeachment because he took the power from Congress over the impeachment process away from Congress, and he became the judge and jury." ~Lindsey Graham

kiidcarter8

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3157 on: April 18, 2020, 06:41:00 PM »

At Palmeiro's rate through age 25 (non-steroid) he'd have had 1400+hits by age 30.

The actual number he got to was 1455 (then 2321 by age 35, right at the 170 hits a year he got pre-steroids)

I havent heard anything about steroids PREVENTING injury - which was the real incredible nature of Raffy's career - he played 154 games on average from age 23 to 39 - and this was INCLUDING the strike year of 1994 (when he played just 111)
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kiidcarter8

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3158 on: April 18, 2020, 06:44:03 PM »

What year do you think Raffy started with the steroids?


      
1987   22   CHC   NL   84   244   221   32   61   15   1   14   30   2   2   20   26   .276   .336   .543   .879   126   120   4   1   0   2   1   73/9   
1988   23   CHC   NL   152   629   580   75   178   41   5   8   53   12   2   38   34   .307   .349   .436   .785   121   253   11   3   2   6   6   *7/398   AS
1989   24   TEX   AL   156   632   559   76   154   23   4   8   64   4   3   63   48   .275   .354   .374   .728   104   209   18   6   2   2   3   *3/D7   
1990   25   TEX   AL   154   651   598   72   191   35   6   14   89   3   3   40   59   .319   .361   .468   .829   131   280   24   3   2   8   6   *3/D   MVP-14
1991   26   TEX   AL   159   714   631   115   203   49   3   26   88   4   3   68   72   .322   .389   .532   .922   155   336   17   6   2   7   10   *3/D   AS,MVP-19
1992   27   TEX   AL   159   701   608   84   163   27   4   22   85   2   3   72   83   .268   .352   .434   .786   123   264   10   10   5   6   8   *3/D   
1993   28   TEX   AL   160   686   597   124   176   40   2   37   105   22   3   73   85   .295   .371   .554   .926   150   331   8   5   2   9   22   *3   MVP-8
1994   29   BAL   AL   111   498   436   82   139   32   0   23   76   7   3   54   63   .319   .392   .550   .942   136   240   11   2   0   6   1   *3   MVP-16
1995   30   BAL   AL   143   624   554   89   172   30   2   39   104   3   1   62   65   .310   .380   .583   .963   145   323   12   3   0   5   5   *3   MVP-11
1996   31   BAL   AL   162   732   626   110   181   40   2   39   142   8   0   95   96   .289   .381   .546   .927   132   342   9   3   0   8   12   *3/D   MVP-6
1997   32   BAL   AL   158   692   614   95   156   24   2   38   110   5   2   67   109   .254   .329   .485   .815   113   298   14   5   0   6   7   *3/D   MVP-13,GG
1998   33   BAL   AL   162   709   619   98   183   36   1   43   121   11   7   79   91   .296   .379   .565   .945   144   350   14   7   0   4   8   *3/D   AS,MVP-18,GG,SS
1999   34   TEX   AL   158   674   565   96   183   30   1   47   148   2   4   97   69   .324   .420   .630   1.050   160   356   13   3   0   9   14   *D3   AS,MVP-5,GG,SS
2000   35   TEX   AL   158   678   565   102   163   29   3   39   120   2   1   103   77   .288   .397   .558   .954   138   315   14   3   0   7   17   3D   
2001   36   TEX   AL   160   714   600   98   164   33   0   47   123   1   1   101   90   .273   .381   .563   .944   141   338   8   7   0   6   8   *3D   MVP-14
2002   37   TEX   AL   155   663   546   99   149   34   0   43   105   2   0   104   94   .273   .391   .571   .962   146   312   10   6   0   7   16   3D   
2003   38   TEX   AL   154   654   561   92   146   21   2   38   112   2   0   84   77   .260   .359   .508   .867   116   285   7   5   0   4   9   D3   
2004   39   BAL   AL   154   651   550   68   142   29   0   23   88   2   1   86   61   .258   .359   .436   .796   108   240   15   6   0   9   15   *3D   
2005   40   BAL   AL   110   422   369   47   98   13   0   18   60   2   0   43   43   .266   .339   .447   .786   108   165   9   2   0   8   4   3D   
20 Yrs   2831   12046   10472   1663   3020   585   38   569   1835   97   40   1353   1348   .288   .371   .515   .885   132   5388   232   87   15   119   172      
162 Game Avg.   162   689   599   95   173   33   2   33   105   6   2   77   77   .288   .371   .515   .885   132   308   13   5   1   7   10      
« Last Edit: April 18, 2020, 06:47:11 PM by kiidcarter8 »
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josh

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3159 on: April 18, 2020, 09:04:15 PM »



versus
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The day Richard Nixon failed to answer that subpoena is the day he was subject to impeachment because he took the power from Congress over the impeachment process away from Congress, and he became the judge and jury." ~Lindsey Graham

josh

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3160 on: April 18, 2020, 09:51:10 PM »

Palmeiro had an average of 2 more hits per year in 163 fewer at bats, which is why he was a .300 hitter through those years vs. Bonds' .286.

But in Bond's 581 extra plate appearances, he had 437 more walks, of which 134 were intentional. Despite that, not only did Bonds have 327 more total bases, including 98 more home runs, but also 158 more runs batted in. Had he been walked as little as Palmeiro, the gap would have been that much wider, as the overwhelming bulk of those times there were men on base.

The stolen bases also set Bonds apart from Palmeiro. And, for good or ill, that one admitted to having done steroids though never having failed a test, while the other denied (and denies) it despite having failed a test.

You asked when I thought Palmeiro might have started and I would guess the same year that Bonds did. Palmeiro hit .254 in 1997 and bounced back with .296 in '98, then .324 in '99. Perhaps in May of that year, when he realized he could not catch up to the ball, hitting .239, followed by months of .354 and .326.

That's all guesswork. I could just believe him that he never knowingly took them and that it was coincedence that after a declining batting average for 5 years after that .324 he bounced back in 2005. But he slumped out of the gate, hitting .247, before rebounding with .302 in May.

He did not recover after the suspension and never played again after the end of August 2005, despite asserting that he could still hit. "It's all in the mind," he explained. But it wasn't - it was all in the body.
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The day Richard Nixon failed to answer that subpoena is the day he was subject to impeachment because he took the power from Congress over the impeachment process away from Congress, and he became the judge and jury." ~Lindsey Graham

kiidcarter8

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3161 on: April 19, 2020, 12:28:41 PM »

I have no idea why you felt the need to compare Barry and Raffy.
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josh

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3162 on: April 19, 2020, 01:59:27 PM »

I have no idea why you felt the need to compare Barry and Raffy.

If no Palmeiro, no Bonds

Ring any bells?! You made the comparison first.
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The day Richard Nixon failed to answer that subpoena is the day he was subject to impeachment because he took the power from Congress over the impeachment process away from Congress, and he became the judge and jury." ~Lindsey Graham

kidcarter8

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3163 on: April 19, 2020, 05:44:34 PM »

That statement is not comparing them.

It is my opinion.  If Bonds is in, so is Palmeiro.  Says nothing of Palmeiro being Bonds equal any more than saying Jack Morris is the equal of Sandy Koufax.  Just both Hall of Famers.
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josh

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Re: Major League Baseball
« Reply #3164 on: April 19, 2020, 06:54:54 PM »

That statement is not comparing them.

It is my opinion.  If Bonds is in, so is Palmeiro.  Says nothing of Palmeiro being Bonds equal any more than saying Jack Morris is the equal of Sandy Koufax.  Just both Hall of Famers.

Hahahaha.

"It's not comparing them. It's my opinion."

Kid, you are a buffoon.

It is a comparison to say that if Palmeiro can't get in, then Bonds should not.
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The day Richard Nixon failed to answer that subpoena is the day he was subject to impeachment because he took the power from Congress over the impeachment process away from Congress, and he became the judge and jury." ~Lindsey Graham
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