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Reports of protests are overblown. A few incidents around the country, but nothing major.

5 (45.5%)

A few major incidents in capitals, but nothing much in DC.

5 (45.5%)

A major incident in DC, but nothing much around the country.

0 (0%)

More than 10 capitals have major upheavals, but nothing much in DC.

0 (0%)

A major incident in DC plus more than 10 capitals with significant upheavals.

1 (9.1%)

More than half the capitals around the country have problems with protesters, but DC is quiet.

0 (0%)

DC has major problems, while more than half the capitals around the country also have considerable trouble with protesters.

0 (0%)

Huge disruption to the day.

0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 9

Voting closed: January 19, 2021, 10:49:21 PM

[LarryBnDC]

That you're a contortionist. 

Yes, I've researched the Kochs.

No you haven’t.

You've read Jane Mayer's book, I presume?  No?  Did you grow up in Wichita, in a family of journalists who knew all about how dad Fred made his nut?  No?  Here, let me help you along.....

  Fred Koch, the patriarch of the family, was an expert in building oil refineries, and he and a friend named William Rhodes Davis proposed building one in Germany during 1934, '35, that period in there. In 1933, Adolf Hitler became chancellor of the Third Reich in Germany, so this meant working under the Third Reich. And in order to get permission, they actually had to go to Hitler himself, and William Rhodes Davis did the "Heil Hitler" to greet Hitler, and finally they got Hitler to greenlight this proposal so that they could build an oil refinery in Hamburg....   

And the Hamburg Oil Refinery, built by the Winkler-Koch Co., became key, according to several German historians I talked to, to Hitler's war efforts. By the time they built it, it was already clear that Hitler had very major military ambitions, but one of the things he was unable to do was to refine high-octane oil for warplanes. What this plant did was create that capacity, and it eventually supplied much of the fuel that was needed for Hitler's Luftwaffe.

He was not a Nazi, and I certainly don't suggest that in the book, but what he was was an American businessman looking for a good deal, and he was looking all over the world to see how he could make some money. Oddly, and what's been known before, is before working under Hitler's Third Reich, Fred Koch had worked for Stalin, where — under Stalin's first five-year plan — Fred Koch helped build up the Russian, the Soviet oil refineries and really gave huge muscle to the oil industry in the Soviet Union....   

https://www.npr.org/2016/01/19/463565987/hidden-history-of-koch-brothers-traces-their-childhood-and-political-rise

I love the part about Charlie's and Fred Jr's nanny being a fervent Nazi.   Don't be stupid, be a smarty....

Also the part about stealing oil from Indian reservations.  Fine All-American boys!

Quite!

Wish I’d read this post before I responded to kiidcarter’s ‘puppet’ jape.

[LarryBnDC]

That you're a contortionist. 

Yes, I've researched the Kochs.

No you haven’t.

You've read Jane Mayer's book, I presume?  No?  Did you grow up in Wichita, in a family of journalists who knew all about how dad Fred made his nut?  No?  Here, let me help you along.....

  Fred Koch, the patriarch of the family, was an expert in building oil refineries, and he and a friend named William Rhodes Davis proposed building one in Germany during 1934, '35, that period in there. In 1933, Adolf Hitler became chancellor of the Third Reich in Germany, so this meant working under the Third Reich. And in order to get permission, they actually had to go to Hitler himself, and William Rhodes Davis did the "Heil Hitler" to greet Hitler, and finally they got Hitler to greenlight this proposal so that they could build an oil refinery in Hamburg....   

And the Hamburg Oil Refinery, built by the Winkler-Koch Co., became key, according to several German historians I talked to, to Hitler's war efforts. By the time they built it, it was already clear that Hitler had very major military ambitions, but one of the things he was unable to do was to refine high-octane oil for warplanes. What this plant did was create that capacity, and it eventually supplied much of the fuel that was needed for Hitler's Luftwaffe.

He was not a Nazi, and I certainly don't suggest that in the book, but what he was was an American businessman looking for a good deal, and he was looking all over the world to see how he could make some money. Oddly, and what's been known before, is before working under Hitler's Third Reich, Fred Koch had worked for Stalin, where — under Stalin's first five-year plan — Fred Koch helped build up the Russian, the Soviet oil refineries and really gave huge muscle to the oil industry in the Soviet Union....   

https://www.npr.org/2016/01/19/463565987/hidden-history-of-koch-brothers-traces-their-childhood-and-political-rise

I love the part about Charlie's and Fred Jr's nanny being a fervent Nazi.   Don't be stupid, be a smarty....

Also the part about stealing oil from Indian reservations.  Fine All-American boys!

Let us all know when you get to Koch Industries that were taken over by Charles and David in 1983. and its subsequent investment strategies.
it might take more time that your hurried previous Google search.

Yeah, that was about ten years after they hooked up with Paul Weyrich, Richard Mellon Scaife etc al to found American Legislative Exchange Council in the early 70s.

The Kochs are smack dab in the middle of a bunch of rich, racist pricks.

[barton]

Let us all know when you get to Koch Industries that were taken over by Charles and David in 1983. and its subsequent investment strategies.
it might take more time that your hurried previous Google search.

Not hurried.  Been aware of the Koch family since the 1960s, when we lived in Wichita.  Sure, they've done a fair amount of whitewashing and laundering since the 80s.  Dave sponsors "Nova"!  Woohoo.   Meanwhile the dark money flows.  And flows.

[facilitatorn]

Red only sticks his tongue up the ass of the best people.

[REDSTATEWARD]

Uh huh.   No one has denied that Horowitz found errors in the FISA app.   Doesn't invalidate the major findings of his report I just shared with you.

The “ major” findings?
The “ low threshold” needed to open an investigation?
But findings by the same IG uncovers blatant lies and false information to perpetuate that investigation are not “ major” to you?

[REDSTATEWARD]

Let us all know when you get to Koch Industries that were taken over by Charles and David in 1983. and its subsequent investment strategies.
it might take more time that your hurried previous Google search.

Not hurried.  Been aware of the Koch family since the 1960s, when we lived in Wichita.  Sure, they've done a fair amount of whitewashing and laundering since the 80s.  Dave sponsors "Nova"!  Woohoo.   Meanwhile the dark money flows.  And flows.

And flows where?

[NeedsAdjustments]

Uh huh.   No one has denied that Horowitz found errors in the FISA app.   Doesn't invalidate the major findings of his report I just shared with you.

The “ major” findings?
The “ low threshold” needed to open an investigation?
But findings by the same IG uncovers blatant lies and false information to perpetuate that investigation are not “ major” to you?

Bark bark bark.

The FBI omitted information re: the Steel Dossier that should have been included in the FISA warrants as part of their application to continue the Carter Page surveillance.  Not to "perpetuate the investigation."

And the report makes clear that a) the Steele Dossier was not the only predicate for that surveillance and b) the report declines to say whether or not those omissions were material to the granting of those warrants.

And while this may be significant to reform FBI operations and the FISA process, it does not in any material way discount the validity of the investigation.  Which is exactly what the IG report says. 

This is why Nunes' memo was a dud when it finally dropped after we were promised a scandal bigger than watergate.  Its small fries compared to the enormity of what was being investigated.  And it is only being amplified again by Republicans (specifically, Barr) in a well timed attempt to distract from Ukraine. 

[facilitatorn]

Let us all know when you get to Koch Industries that were taken over by Charles and David in 1983. and its subsequent investment strategies.
it might take more time that your hurried previous Google search.

Not hurried.  Been aware of the Koch family since the 1960s, when we lived in Wichita.  Sure, they've done a fair amount of whitewashing and laundering since the 80s.  Dave sponsors "Nova"!  Woohoo.   Meanwhile the dark money flows.  And flows.

And flows where?

The republican party, the US courts, and into programming schmucks like you.

[NeedsAdjustments]

And if anyone still can't get a hold on the central lie here, note that Barr is out today repeating how the whole thing was "a completely bogus narrative that was largely fanned and hyped by a completely irresponsible press.”

You simply can not read the Mueller Report and honestly conclude that the investigation was "completely bogus."  Its a giveaway.  As I said this morning; honesty has gone out the window for this GOP.

[NeedsAdjustments]

Uh huh.   No one has denied that Horowitz found errors in the FISA app.   Doesn't invalidate the major findings of his report I just shared with you.

The “ major” findings?
The “ low threshold” needed to open an investigation?
But findings by the same IG uncovers blatant lies and false information to perpetuate that investigation are not “ major” to you?

English must be a foreign language to you.

I might have posted that response if I was feeling less generous to you.  Certainly would have been fair.  But I did not.

[NeedsAdjustments]

You simply can not read the Mueller Report and honestly conclude that the investigation was "completely bogus."

Or for that matter have paid any attention to the government's case against Roger Stone which I am assuming Barr is at least tangentially aware of.

[facilitatorn]

Abusing power, obstructing Congress, failing America - trump 2020.

http://www.salon.com/2019/12/10/experts-on-impeachment-is-this-the-express-lane-version-or-a-democratic-masterstroke/

[LarryBnDC]

The House Democrats need to haul Barr’s ass in and make him explain “What the Fuck?”

[NeedsAdjustments]

The House Democrats need to haul Barr’s ass in and make him explain “What the Fuck?”

Lynch needed to recuse herself from the investigation into Clinton because of a five minute conversation with Clinton’s husband on the tarmac of an airport.

Barr is implicated specifically as part of the whistleblower complaint he tried to bury, and on the Trump-Zelenski call which have led to articles of impeachment and should be the subject of a special council investigation and I have yet to hear a single Democrat call for him to recuse himself. 

It’s insane how Democrats consistently get lapped by Republicans on messaging.  That shit isn’t that hard.

[barton]

Let us all know when you get to Koch Industries that were taken over by Charles and David in 1983. and its subsequent investment strategies.
it might take more time that your hurried previous Google search.

Not hurried.  Been aware of the Koch family since the 1960s, when we lived in Wichita.  Sure, they've done a fair amount of whitewashing and laundering since the 80s.  Dave sponsors "Nova"!  Woohoo.   Meanwhile the dark money flows.  And flows.

And flows where?

Tea party.
Union busting.
Science denial/distortion
ALEC (buying legislators and judges, buying immunity from penalties for polluting, promoting white nationalism and Islamophobia, dismantling public education..when even Dow Chem detects a bad odor and stops donating to them, Koch Foundation always comes through with more money...)
Citizens for a Sound Economy—which launched the effort to repeal Glass-Steagall protections keeping banks from gambling in securities.
Etc.

In 1980, you may recall that David Koch was the Libertarian candidate for VPOTUS.  The party’s plans included the abolition of Medicare, Medicaid, social security (to be made voluntary), the Department of Transportation, the Federal Aviation Administration, the Environmental Protection Agency, the Department of Energy, the Food and Drug Administration, and the Consumer Product Safety Commission.

The L party also sought to privatize all roads and highways, to privatize all schools, to privatize all mail delivery and, eventually, the repeal of all taxation.   Papa Fred liked to tell everyone that Eisenhower was a communist tool.   You heard that right.   Ike.  A Commie! 

But yeah, Kochs donated an exhibit at the NY Natural History museum....cause they're all about science...and the kids!