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Reports of protests are overblown. A few incidents around the country, but nothing major.

5 (45.5%)

A few major incidents in capitals, but nothing much in DC.

5 (45.5%)

A major incident in DC, but nothing much around the country.

0 (0%)

More than 10 capitals have major upheavals, but nothing much in DC.

0 (0%)

A major incident in DC plus more than 10 capitals with significant upheavals.

1 (9.1%)

More than half the capitals around the country have problems with protesters, but DC is quiet.

0 (0%)

DC has major problems, while more than half the capitals around the country also have considerable trouble with protesters.

0 (0%)

Huge disruption to the day.

0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 9

Voting closed: January 19, 2021, 10:49:21 PM

[REDSTATEWARD]

I think you are catching on that some citizens - and even some leaders disagree with the level of "lockdown" governors are getting entire states to.

Easy answer?  Still no.

A "right" and a "wrong"?  Nope.

The reason we have economies,  in a democracy, is to lift everyone.   

So,  we don't sacrifice some people to lift others.   The founding principles of America include that the individual life has value and dignity.

I wonder if Barton actually read what he wrote before hitting post.
Ending economies helps no one.
And continued lockdowns will sacrifice many more people than ending the lockdowns will.

In logic this is called the fallacy of the excluded middle.   
You see only two narrowly defined choices of awful,  when we have others. 

Wow! Are we supposed to feel better that there are more awful things than 30 million people out of work draining our resources to save them but not giving them a chance to make a living? 

[Hairy Lime]

I think you are catching on that some citizens - and even some leaders disagree with the level of "lockdown" governors are getting entire states to.

Easy answer?  Still no.

A "right" and a "wrong"?  Nope.

Americans still overwhelmingly support the "lockdowns."  I posted recently a breakdown by business. 

This also contradicts REDSTATEWARD's contention that we are all just going to accept people dying of COVID19, which is a separate issue from the "lockdowns."  Because if we really are ok with getting sick and possibly dying, then the choice he alludes to is real.  Governors reopen their states and people head out to restaurants and movie theaters in droves, all returns to normal.

Of course, as with most things REDSTATEWARD says, it has no relationship with reality.  The choice he presents is a false one.  Removing the "lockdowns" without pairing with routine testing and contact tracing is not going to give most people the confidence to go back to life as normal.  And even the states that have opened up have done it in a limited way that is insignificant to the economy.

The end result is that we get sicker, and still saddled with a huge economic downturn which is at this point, thanks to Trump's world-class fuck-up of a response, a certainty.

Needs seems to think sending the economy into a long and senseless depression through lockdowns will have some positive effect on covid-19. But he won’t recognize the overall acceleration of deaths by other causes along with ruined lives, mental illness, future generations deprived of a decent education, et al is a price we are not signing up for.
But what he is really afraid of is turning the country back into the hands of the people.

Oh look! Red is pretending to care about the negative social impact of government policy again! The negative social impact of cuts to SNAP or education or mental health programs, or the attempts at the wholesale elimination of health insurance for millions of the working poor, or the impact on health and mortality from deregulation of.polluters? Hell no! Red got his tax cut!

[Hairy Lime]

I think you are catching on that some citizens - and even some leaders disagree with the level of "lockdown" governors are getting entire states to.

Easy answer?  Still no.

A "right" and a "wrong"?  Nope.

The reason we have economies,  in a democracy, is to lift everyone.   

So,  we don't sacrifice some people to lift others.   The founding principles of America include that the individual life has value and dignity.

I wonder if Barton actually read what he wrote before hitting post.
Ending economies helps no one.
And continued lockdowns will sacrifice many more people than ending the lockdowns will.

In logic this is called the fallacy of the excluded middle.   
You see only two narrowly defined choices of awful,  when we have others. 

Wow! Are we supposed to feel better that there are more awful things than 30 million people out of work draining our resources to save them but not giving them a chance to make a living?

Hundreds of thousands of deaths while the fear and effects of a raging pandemic keep most of those people out of work anyway, and for far longer?

[josh]

Lockdowns cause more deaths and greater misery.

You keep saying that, but provide no substantiation for it. 1918 suggests you are full of crap.

And what Ward is really afraid of is heeding the voice of the people, 75% of whom oppose opening things back up, incuding 57% of the GOP. lol

Josh ignores the movement to reopen. Fortunately he is powerless to stop it.
[/quote]

You can't do simple math, Ward. It isn't ignoring the movement. It's recognizing that the moment isn't even 30% of the country.

[josh]

Very sneaky, Obama

Trump now calls him out for treason.  I get what Barack is doing.  As Hillary floundered, he uttered, "this old fuck would never have beaten me".. So now he will make it SEEM like Trump is running against Obama, not Biden.

As the Twitter war grows, trump can only be thankful Barack cant actually be on the trail.


(unless of course Trump is right about the actions of the former president while in office)

"sneaky of Obama"

You mean, because he knows that Trump is an out-of-control narcissistic fool?

[kiidcarter8]

Program note:


Kushner on Hannity.

[facilitatorn]

Program note:


Kushner on Hannity.

Lifestyles of the Sick and Feckless

[Hairy Lime]

Lockdowns cause more deaths and greater misery.

You keep saying that, but provide no substantiation for it. 1918 suggests you are full of crap.

And what Ward is really afraid of is heeding the voice of the people, 75% of whom oppose opening things back up, incuding 57% of the GOP. lol

Josh ignores the movement to reopen. Fortunately he is powerless to stop it.

You can't do simple math, Ward. It isn't ignoring the movement. It's recognizing that the moment isn't even 30% of the country.
[/quote]Red is very fond of astroturf.

[kiidcarter8]

Oh no he didnt

Cuomo just now on CNN went with the CNN.com headline rather than read through the entire article - either that or he just decided not to include that those suffering heart arythmia/heart attack under hydrochloroquine doses already ha cardiovascular disease

Gupta at least had the smarts to call it an observational study, not a trial.  Sanjay does a nice job usually getting his point across without making the host look bad - but of course after Cuomo's last word on the matter that ended the segment.

Damage done to Trump with report - ZERO

Most everyone tuning in is a Biden voter anyway.  That is why ratings suck.

[kiidcarter8]

Why CNN ratings are low:

They are not comprehensive SHOWS - they are infomercials.

Nobody wants the anti-Trump speak for an entire hour every night.

[josh]

Why CNN ratings are low:

They are not comprehensive SHOWS - they are infomercials.

Nobody wants the anti-Trump speak for an entire hour every night.

No, but a fine theory.

CNN ratings are low because more of the folks who would watch CNN know how to read and how to use the internet.

The folks who want the Trump's Cheerleader program watch Fox all the time and swallow it wholesale.

This is why their viewers do so poorly on tests of current events and US history.

[josh]

Trump keeps saying tests are totally available.

He continues to lie about it.

Today, Gov. Dewine contradicted him.

Why do you people support a perpetual liar like Trump?

[REDSTATEWARD]

Lockdowns cause more deaths and greater misery.

You keep saying that, but provide no substantiation for it. 1918 suggests you are full of crap.

And what Ward is really afraid of is heeding the voice of the people, 75% of whom oppose opening things back up, incuding 57% of the GOP. lol

Josh ignores the movement to reopen. Fortunately he is powerless to stop it.


You can't do simple math, Ward. It isn't ignoring the movement. It's recognizing that the moment isn't even 30% of the country.

LOL

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/national/states-reopening-coronavirus-map/

[kiidcarter8]

Trump keeps saying tests are totally available.

He continues to lie about it.

Today, Gov. Dewine contradicted him.

Why do you people support a perpetual liar like Trump?

You know why

[josh]

Trump keeps saying tests are totally available.

He continues to lie about it.

Today, Gov. Dewine contradicted him.

Why do you people support a perpetual liar like Trump?

You know why

Because you don't give a damn about anybody but yourself and you lie to yourself about the poor and the vulnerable.

Okay, you're right. I do.

It doesn't explain why you pretend to believe his lies.