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Reports of protests are overblown. A few incidents around the country, but nothing major.

5 (45.5%)

A few major incidents in capitals, but nothing much in DC.

5 (45.5%)

A major incident in DC, but nothing much around the country.

0 (0%)

More than 10 capitals have major upheavals, but nothing much in DC.

0 (0%)

A major incident in DC plus more than 10 capitals with significant upheavals.

1 (9.1%)

More than half the capitals around the country have problems with protesters, but DC is quiet.

0 (0%)

DC has major problems, while more than half the capitals around the country also have considerable trouble with protesters.

0 (0%)

Huge disruption to the day.

0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 9

Voting closed: January 19, 2021, 10:49:21 PM

[Echo4]

[facilitatorn]

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/jun/04/vallejo-police-kill-unarmed-man-california

The hits keep piling up

Like the gangs and the government are no different.

[facilitatorn]

http://www.politico.com/news/2020/06/04/trump-murkowski-campaign-mattis-302308

The more trump isolates himself the less bloodshed there will be bringing him down.

[bambu.]

You do what you like with them...your country, your legal system, your race war.

40 years in prison for the trainee's on the job for only days? and one who wasn't anywhere near George Floyd.
Not too sure about all that.

Two even questioned Chauvin.
What were they supposed to do, shoot Chauvin?

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/04/us/george-floyd-thursday/index.html

J. Alexander Kueng, Thomas Lane and Tou Thao appeared in court one day after they were arrested and charged with aiding and abetting second-degree murder and aiding and abetting second-degree manslaughter.
The charges follow those first brought against Derek Chauvin, the officer who pinned Floyd to the ground by his neck for nearly 9 minutes.

Attorneys for the two other defendants worked to contrast their clients' experience as police officers with Chauvin's, who spent more than 18 years with the Minneapolis Police Department.
When Floyd's death took place, it was Kueng's third shift as a police officer, said Thomas Plunkett, his attorney. Chauvin, he added, was Kueng's training officer.

Plunkett said Kueng turned to Chauvin at one point and said, "You can't do this."

Lane had been on the police force for four days when Floyd died, according to his attorney Earl Gray. Lane was "doing everything he thought he was supposed to do as a four-day police officer," Gray said.

"You've got a 20-year cop in the front and my guy is in the back there with four days," Gray said after his court appearance. "I don't know what you're supposed to do as a cop."

When asked by CNN whether he was implying Lane was following orders, Gray said no. But his client thought that what he was doing was right, Gray said, because Chauvin refused to turn Floyd on his side after Lane asked if they should.

Minnesota Attorney General Keith Ellison said he's confident the evidence supports new and more serious charges.

In the meantime, officials released more details on Floyd's autopsy.

His death was due to cardiopulmonary arrest -- or the stopping of his heart -- according to the final autopsy results released Wednesday by the Hennepin County Medical Examiner.
His neck was compressed when the officer's knee was on it for more than eight minutes, the report says, but does not conclude that it directly caused his death.

The autopsy says Floyd had heart disease and a history of high blood pressure. A preliminary toxicology report found moderate levels of fentanyl and methamphetamine.
The county autopsy also indicates that Floyd had tested positive for coronavirus in April.

But an independent autopsy commissioned by the Floyd family disagreed with the county's conclusion, saying he died of "asphyxiation from sustained pressure."

 

[facilitatorn]

Before you take the coin, read the manual.

Some indentures are weighted with stiff consequences for straying from their precepts.

He’s going into the manual now for anyone giving thought to taking up the badge.

He’s also in a memo to every cop who has a fellow officer or officers who are more or less like Chauvin in their squad to take a hard look and decide if they want to do time for these lovely individuals.

Hopefully it will have a profound effect on the profession.

There are people who live rich meaningful lives after doing stretches for accessory to murder.

Perhaps he’ll find Islam.

[facilitatorn]

There are not going to be enough cells for all the officers.

It’s like McCall, South Carolina back in the 90’s writ large.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_5ed9a813c5b612ac98d2e5b7

Commissioner needs to be canned and chucked in a river tomorrow by sunup.

[facilitatorn]

Note to those in NYC jails tonight. Before you sue the city, sue the PD’s pension fund. It’s a fatter whale anyway these days what with #bunkerboi dissolving the economy.

Go after cop shops like they’re oil companies if they can’t get their act straight. Hit them in the bank.

[bambu.]

Before you take the coin, read the manual.

Some indentures are weighted with stiff consequences for straying from their precepts.

He’s going into the manual now for anyone giving thought to taking up the badge.

He’s also in a memo to every cop who has a fellow officer or officers who are more or less like Chauvin in their squad to take a hard look and decide if they want to do time for these lovely individuals.

Hopefully it will have a profound effect on the profession.

There are people who live rich meaningful lives after doing stretches for accessory to murder.

Perhaps he’ll find Islam.

Fair enough.
Though 3rd shift in the force and 4 days in the force wasn't much time to take a hard look.

My CNN link begs the question.

What would you have actually done if you'd been Kueng, Lane, and Thao?

[bodiddley]

If those two other cops were indeed such neophytes, the charges will likely not stick or be significantly reduced.  But charging them can make it clear that not just the directly offending officer is responsible, but when you're on Team Blue, you have to make sure things stay safe and lawful.

I believe one newbie had policing experience at a school and as security guard at a mall or somesuch.  Maybe nearly a decade of such security work.  But yeah, Chauvin put them in a horrible position, was a police vet and their leader, and the one did reportedly suggest moderating the brutality, as per procedure. 

I feel bad for them and they'll likely get off.  Maybe Chauvin was actually showing off for these neophytes, indoctrinating them in the power and impunity of the police.  In other words, the torture of Mr. Floyd might have been for the benefit of the two rooks, in Chauvin's twisted mind.

The Asian officer had nearly a decade of experience.  I assume much of his defense will be that mostly he had his back to the knee-on-the-neck killing and was engaged in crowd control.  One weakness in his argument is that the crowd was alerting him that the suspect was in pain, was being abused, couldn't breathe, was dying.  But in a sense he allowed the senior officer to deal with the suspect, while he arguably did his job at crowd control.

Chauvin's going to jail and I'm glad they went with murder charges instead of manslaughter which is what such cases usually are prosecuted as (the few that get prosecuted).  I don't know Minnesota's penal code, or if it's based on the Model Penal code or not, but generally the difference between 3rd degree murder and manslaughter isn't that much.  The new charge of 2nd degree murder is indeed a level up.

I only saw less than 2 mins of the video recording the police killing of George Floyd. The two junior officers don't even appear.  Though I think one taunts Floyd as not being such a tough guy anymore.  And during that time, the Asian officer does crowd control and doesn't look at the intentional Chauvin violence.

[bambu.]

If those two other cops were indeed such neophytes, the charges will likely not stick or be significantly reduced.  But charging them can make it clear that not just the directly offending officer is responsible, but when you're on Team Blue, you have to make sure things stay safe and lawful.

I believe one newbie had policing experience at a school and as security guard at a mall or somesuch.  Maybe nearly a decade of such security work.  But yeah, Chauvin put them in a horrible position, was a police vet and their leader, and the one did reportedly suggest moderating the brutality, as per procedure. 

I feel bad for them and they'll likely get off.  Maybe Chauvin was actually showing off for these neophytes, indoctrinating them in the power and impunity of the police.  In other words, the torture of Mr. Floyd might have been for the benefit of the two rooks, in Chauvin's twisted mind.

The Asian officer had nearly a decade of experience.  I assume much of his defense will be that mostly he had his back to the knee-on-the-neck killing and was engaged in crowd control.  One weakness in his argument is that the crowd was alerting him that the suspect was in pain, was being abused, couldn't breathe, was dying.  But in a sense he allowed the senior officer to deal with the suspect, while he arguably did his job at crowd control.

Chauvin's going to jail and I'm glad they went with murder charges instead of manslaughter which is what such cases usually are prosecuted as (the few that get prosecuted).  I don't know Minnesota's penal code, or if it's based on the Model Penal code or not, but generally the difference between 3rd degree murder and manslaughter isn't that much.  The new charge of 2nd degree murder is indeed a level up.

I only saw less than 2 mins of the video recording the police killing of George Floyd. The two junior officers don't even appear.  Though I think one taunts Floyd as not being such a tough guy anymore.  And during that time, the Asian officer does crowd control and doesn't look at the intentional Chauvin violence.

What would you have actually done if you'd been Kueng, Lane, Thao? 

[bodiddley]

I agree they were in a difficult situation.
But the sustained assault on Floyd went on for a rather long time.

They could have said he was fully restrained and it was time to get the suspect into the police car.  Very reasonable.

Or that it looked dangerous and the guy might really be in distress or unable to breathe.  Hey man, you don't want to kill the guy by accident.

Or reminded Chauvin that this was just a counterfeiting suspect (who might have resisted) and they should ease up.

or noted that the crowd was videoing the chokehold and that it was going to look bad if he didn't let up.

Or question whether the extended knee on the neck wasn't dangerous and against policy.

Or offer to take over.

or just telling Chauvin to fucking stop.

Again, it's hard to believe an experienced officer is not just willing to brutalize a suspect in broad daylight in front of witnesses, but will take that so far as to actually kill the guy.  But even the extended infliction of pain and fear and profound discomfort is illegal and wrong and shouldn't be tolerated.  Even if this didn't end in death, it should have been stopped.  Use your police training, use your humanity.

[bodiddley]

What would you have actually done if you'd been Kueng, Lane, Thao?

I didn't actually see the other two officers in the roughly 2 minute snuff clip.
The two neophytes were put in a bad position.

But Thao was a trained officer with a decade of experience.
He could have responded to the crowd's strong concern, by offering to take a look and make sure things were okay.  Since there were 4 officers there, he could have simply called over one of the newbies to do the basic crowd control while he checked to make sure things remained legal and safe and the suspect was okay and not in distress.  The idea was simply to restrain and subdue Floyd, not to brutalize and harm him.

If Chauvin was going rogue and doing nasty illegal ish, Thao was the main one in a position to stand up to him and redirect the situation away from a bad outcome and eventually murder.  There was enough time for Thao to take action, stop illegality (his job), and as it turned out save a life.  I don't know if he will be found guilty for his crime of omission, but at least he'll have to sweat it out for his failure to act responsibly.  My initial impression is that Chauvin will go to jail for 20 years and the others will get off.  The charges against the two neophytes might even get dropped or reduced along the way.

[bambu.]

I agree they were in a difficult situation.
But the sustained assault on Floyd went on for a rather long time.

They could have said he was fully restrained and it was time to get the suspect into the police car.  Very reasonable.

Or that it looked dangerous and the guy might really be in distress or unable to breathe.  Hey man, you don't want to kill the guy by accident.

Or reminded Chauvin that this was just a counterfeiting suspect (who might have resisted) and they should ease up.

or noted that the crowd was videoing the chokehold and that it was going to look bad if he didn't let up.

Or question whether the extended knee on the neck wasn't dangerous and against policy.

Or offer to take over.

or just telling Chauvin to fucking stop.

Again, it's hard to believe an experienced officer is not just willing to brutalize a suspect in broad daylight in front of witnesses, but will take that so far as to actually kill the guy.  But even the extended infliction of pain and fear and profound discomfort is illegal and wrong and shouldn't be tolerated.  Even if this didn't end in death, it should have been stopped.  Use your police training, use your humanity.

The two, Kueng and Lane ...3rd shift in the force and 4 days in the force did question Chauvin.

When Floyd's death took place, it was Kueng's third shift as a police officer, said Thomas Plunkett, his attorney. Chauvin, he added, was Kueng's training officer.
Plunkett said Kueng turned to Chauvin at one point and said, "You can't do this."

Lane had been on the police force for four days when Floyd died, according to his attorney Earl Gray. Lane was "doing everything he thought he was supposed to do as a four-day police officer," Gray said.

"You've got a 20-year cop in the front and my guy is in the back there with four days," Gray said after his court appearance. "I don't know what you're supposed to do as a cop."

But his client thought that what he was doing was right, Gray said, because Chauvin refused to turn Floyd on his side after Lane asked if they should.

In my mind they tried to do something, to their boss.
40 years in prison...baaah!

In my mind, in the heat of the current mood...40 years, the maximum for what they've been charged with, is exactly what they'll get.
Imagine what might happen if they don't.

[facilitatorn]

You have to be aware of what your fellows are doing, always, because along with what you’re doing you are responsible for backing them up.

If you are aware something important is happening you communicate with your group so you can give a coordinated response. An easy one would be “Hey, what’s going on with that guy?”

If the seeing and the talking have you convinced what you are witnessing is a violent crime in progress, as an officer on the clock in uniform, you stop the crime.

I have no idea how that jibes with Minneapolis police policy, but that’s what I hope I‘d do, and it’s what we should expect from every cop.

[facilitatorn]

How is trump still hiding behind John Dowd? I think seeing the graffiti has started to make trump aware of how much of the country hates him and how deeply. It’s probably starting to feel like Atlantic City for him all over again.