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Reports of protests are overblown. A few incidents around the country, but nothing major.

5 (45.5%)

A few major incidents in capitals, but nothing much in DC.

5 (45.5%)

A major incident in DC, but nothing much around the country.

0 (0%)

More than 10 capitals have major upheavals, but nothing much in DC.

0 (0%)

A major incident in DC plus more than 10 capitals with significant upheavals.

1 (9.1%)

More than half the capitals around the country have problems with protesters, but DC is quiet.

0 (0%)

DC has major problems, while more than half the capitals around the country also have considerable trouble with protesters.

0 (0%)

Huge disruption to the day.

0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 9

Voting closed: January 19, 2021, 10:49:21 PM

[Hamilton Samuels]

You have no right to insult, without just cause.

So, ye shall reap what ye shall sow.

Where you are the sole individual who gets to decide what is or is not "just cause."

And back to the threat.

And the ongoing misogyny.

Would you like to form a rules  committee to decide what I think is grounds for engaging an angry adolescent on this forum?

I'll be happy to sit on that committee, as one who has received countless threats, insults, and very strange comments since arriving here shortly ago.

I know, it's different than the mainstream idiocy you feature here, but my own idiocy has its special charm, and my perspective has great value since it does not conform to yours or to those who you like to label as racists, misogynists, transphobic, or whatever the "woke term of the du jour" may be.

Seriously, you put up with this bullshit of "fuck off" and "fuck you" and "asswipe" and "asshole" and "I'll slap you and you'll like it" from everyone else, but I justifiably call out the little Princess of Prospect Park and suddenly it's OMG, there's a stranger in our midst!

I didn;t see you jumping into the fray when the Little Princess and bankshot were exchanging far worse insults, just last week.

Can't you see you are the problem, and not the solution, josh?

[kiidcarter8]

- because police are now supposed to just stand there and get spit on, insulted and hit with stuff.



Which is also why police suicides are way up

"I was a good cop.  I served my community.  I was always prepared, willing to listen, but on guard for situations as I needed to be.  This made me a good living for my young family for twelve years.  I was a proud civil servant with beautiful kids.

"Today, as I take my own life, I apologize to everyone and pray for those who still serve.  I no longer feel like even half a man - and thus cannot go on.  What I have suffered the last three months has been inhumane, deserved of no man.  The animals have won.  I hope my family is proud of what I accomplished serving my city.  Heaven is a better place"


(and yes, this is fiction)

[NeedsAdjustments]

A complete sweep (it might be worrisome for the bystanders, I understand - which is why they say CLEAR out - see DC) of the uglies just needs to happen one time.  But the police are being handcuffed.  This is why there was such outrage at the Navy vet video - because police are now supposed to just stand there and get spit on, insulted and hit with stuff.

The Navy vet asked them why they are violating the oath they took to enter service.  At least, that is what he said was his intent.

We can't tell from video if the Federal Forces were insulted.  We can say that the vet did not spit on them or hit them with stuff.

And no, insulting verbally does not justify getting pepper sprayed or your hand broken in two places.  If these forces were trained in crowd control, they would know that.

[bankshot1]

i know we like to compare Trump with Hitler etc, and the secret police trampling human rights in Portland as SS, but this reminds me of the Putin's army of unmarked military enforcers injected into Ukraine several years ago to disrupt the democratic growing process there.

Yup.  Goes to bodiddley's point too.  Don't sleep on these forces being used to disrupt free and fair elections.

Couldn't happen here?  So much has already happened just this year that I never thought could happen here.

The ease in whch Trump has adopted authoritarian measures to try and rebuild his political base and with little blowback from his party is scary. I posted earlier this year that Trump wanted a '68 Chicago backdrop for his convention to stress law and order and crack heads. He may not get exactly that but that SOB and his AG Barr will do their his damnedest to manufacturer a political criisis from which they hope to profit. The fact that Americans legally engaged in 1st amendment rights and our democracy have been abused by his party of new fascism will be damned by historians and Americans well when the sad history of this time is printed.  One can only hope it will also be damned in November 2020.

VOTE

[kiidcarter8]

A complete sweep (it might be worrisome for the bystanders, I understand - which is why they say CLEAR out - see DC) of the uglies just needs to happen one time.  But the police are being handcuffed.  This is why there was such outrage at the Navy vet video - because police are now supposed to just stand there and get spit on, insulted and hit with stuff.

The Navy vet asked them why they are violating the oath they took to enter service.  At least, that is what he said was his intent.

We can't tell from video if the Federal Forces were insulted.  We can say that the vet did not spit on them or hit them with stuff.

And no, insulting verbally does not justify getting pepper sprayed or your hand broken in two places.  If these forces were trained in crowd control, they would know that.

Nobody here has defended those 2 Feds, Needs

I do see that story is fizzling out

Happened on West Wing after a background check of the guy they were going to highlight at the State of the Union.

Most likely we dont have (nor in your case - want) the entire story.

[josh]

I see there was an attempt - accept my apology


How can the conflict be deescalated to bring that shit to a stop? I don't believe deadly force should be used, but understand the urge to do so.

Officers need to be able to arrest someone without fear it might escalate into a brawl.  "Deadly force" is a misused term here.  Necessary force.



It just seems certain to do the opposite of deescalating things, which makes it more contra-indicated than not.


A complete sweep (it might be worrisome for the bystanders, I understand - which is why they say CLEAR out - see DC) of the uglies just needs to happen one time.  But the police are being handcuffed.  This is why there was such outrage at the Navy vet video - because police are now supposed to just stand there and get spit on, insulted and hit with stuff.

Apology accepted. I in turn just saw this and deleted my response to your plaint about nobody responding.

I said deadly force because I was responding to the general, not specific, situation. I meant exactly what I said. And I don't know what "necessary force" is, as I said. See also: fire hoses. (And note that you are not being accused of editing.)

The DC comparison is right for some places, but not others. The area in front of the church is not one - there was no such command given according to both every eyewitness and all recordings of the event. And even then, it did not justify the gas used.

And yes, the police are explicitly supposed to stand there and get spit on and insulted.

Hit with stuff is a different ball of wax. "He started it" is not a useful discussion, but gets to the key issues, regardless. How to things become more violent and how can we make them less violent?

Anonymous people refusing to answer questions and bundling people into unmarked vans is not deescalating. Neither is "proactive arresting."

If the goal is to protect federal buildings, a frequently repeated claim on the news, then assaulting medical folks assisting an injured person is failing badly, not to mention also not deescalating. See Portland and DC.

[NeedsAdjustments]

Which is also why police suicides are way up

Suicides were up in 2019 before the protests.  Have actually been down during the pandemic (though maybe you have more recent numbers?)

The public the police serve are angry, and their anger is justified.  You agree?  Disagree?  Or do you hide behind a false argument about civility, like UNO?

[josh]

Oh, dearie, don't get your knickers in a twist.

And don't underestimate one, merely because you think you know who you are up against. That kind of hubris can be fatal.

That reads as a threat on my life, UNO.

Is that sort of thing allowed on this forum, Josh?

It read that way to me, also.

No.

[NeedsAdjustments]

Nobody here has defended those 2 Feds, Needs

I do see that story is fizzling out

Happened on West Wing after a background check of the guy they were going to highlight at the State of the Union.

Most likely we dont have (nor in your case - want) the entire story.

You don't defend the 2 Feds, but will cast totally unjustified aspersions onto the victim.   A vet who works at a VA hospital.
 
OK. 

This interview from 18 hours ago, btw:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQ_moOtDqvk

Maybe the news station didn't vet him to reveal the darkness in his past, right? 

[Hamilton Samuels]

I'm just going to point this out one more time, because it is remarkable.

At 11:46 today UNO comes onto the Forum to admonish a poster for being uncivil.

At 4:23 today UNO is literally threatening the life of a poster.

And with zero irony or self-awareness!  I mean, wow.  Truly a remarkable turnabout.

Wow! Look at the Princess go!
 
She's escalating a criticism into a "threat on her life", which is pure and utter BULL.

Bottom line, she can't handle the truth, so she makes up a new one.

It's what leftist extremists do.

That is some deep shit there.

Listen, queenie, no one threatened your life. What one did promise is to send back to you what you've been dishing out to others without hindrance for years.

Your life isn't worth threatening.

So, stop shaking in those high heels of yours.

[josh]

You have no right to insult, without just cause.

So, ye shall reap what ye shall sow.

Where you are the sole individual who gets to decide what is or is not "just cause."

And back to the threat.

And the ongoing misogyny.

Would you like to form a rules  committee to decide what I think is grounds for engaging an angry adolescent on this forum?

No, because I don't give a fuck what YOU think is an insult.

"rights" is not a personal term, Ham.

You've been insulting people all the way along, while decrying insults from others. You are hardly alone in this practice.

Today, you have become particularly ... worked up and reactive.

It's problematic, regardless of what you think of me.

[Hamilton Samuels]

Oh, dearie, don't get your knickers in a twist.

And don't underestimate one, merely because you think you know who you are up against. That kind of hubris can be fatal.

That reads as a threat on my life, UNO.

Is that sort of thing allowed on this forum, Josh?

It read that way to me, also.

No.

Bad choice of words, perhaps, but no intent to threaten anyone's life. Their stupid remarks, yes. Then, no.

And you know that.

So, quit playing games.

[Hamilton Samuels]

You have no right to insult, without just cause.

So, ye shall reap what ye shall sow.

Where you are the sole individual who gets to decide what is or is not "just cause."

And back to the threat.

And the ongoing misogyny.

Would you like to form a rules  committee to decide what I think is grounds for engaging an angry adolescent on this forum?

No, because I don't give a fuck what YOU think is an insult.

"rights" is not a personal term, Ham.

You've been insulting people all the way along, while decrying insults from others. You are hardly alone in this practice.

Today, you have become particularly ... worked up and reactive.

It's problematic, regardless of what you think of me.

Ham?

Confusion reigns supreme, here.

You apparently don't give a fuck what an insult is, unless it comes from someone you  can't easily bring into line, Ward---er Josh.

 

[josh]

Seriously, you put up with this bullshit of "fuck off" and "fuck you" and "asswipe" and "asshole" and "I'll slap you and you'll like it" from everyone else, but I justifiably call out the little Princess of Prospect Park and suddenly it's OMG, there's a stranger in our midst!

If you cannot tell the difference between the two levels of bullshit, that's quite unfortunate.

I don't give a damn about the fuck offs and asswipes, anymore. I was reluctantly convinced a long time ago that that was the standard of discourse here.

I only lampooned your language because you were busy with your self-righteous platitudes about insults not being a right while simultaneously using them.

Then you explained, in full self-righteous wrath of god that because YOU have determined that something gave you just cause, NOW you would give people what they deserved, complete with your patented "could be fatal," which passes for a threat on almost any message board in the land.

So, cut the shit.

Go back to the run of the mill insults. Stop identifying where (you think) people live and stop threatening their lives.

Again.

[kiidcarter8]

In the future, remember -

A comment that is race-related doesn't naturally become racist no matter how much hate in your heart you have for the speaker.

kiidcarter8, I know the difference between racist and race-related.

Defending white supremacists, posting material here from white supremacist message boards about how Obama benefited from affirmative action, posting crimes committed by Black people ("thugs") or Hispanic immigrants (You go, Angel Moms!) as though they justify policies that should be taken against them, posting misinformation to argue that Trayvon Martin had it coming (and doing it again for the next one, and again for the next one, and again for the next one)...that's racism kiidcarter8.

You have a history on these forums, and you may not realize I know how far back it goes.   I know what I see, and call it like I see it. 

So no, I won't pretend I don't know where your opposition of BLM and support of Trump comes from.

So many so called racists do great things for people of color - yes - inclusive of working closely with and befriending them.

I guess actions don't count as much as words and what you THINK they mean.