Escape from Elba

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Poll

How Should Football "Topics" be arranged? (Others will be merged in. Please don't vote both here and in the NFL Poll)

College, NFL
- 1 (25%)
Leave it as it is
- 3 (75%)

Total Members Voted: 3

Voting closed: September 07, 2020, 12:03:02 AM


Pages: 1 ... 5 6 [7] 8 9 ... 251

Author Topic: College Football  (Read 89732 times)

CaptainCargo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1374
  • I see you eyeballing that French girl
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #90 on: August 08, 2018, 01:40:48 PM »

Quote
While sycophants will excuse it as simply lying to the media -- a stupid defense
    Perhaps he felt that it is not his responsibility to dispense justice in this matter. Maybe he is of the opinion that it is the responsibility of the legal system to deal with this situation. It might be that he feels that people are innocent until proven guilty in a court of law, not in the court of public opinion. Maybe he feels that it is not up to him to possibly ruin someones career and/or life until the subject is found guilty in a court of law. Why isn’t this in the purview of the legal system? Go to the police. Present your case. Insist that they press charges against this guy. If that doesn’t work sue him civilly. If he is found guilty by the legal system then it’s the duty of the university (or possibly Myer as the responsible administrator in this area) to fire this guy. Now, obviously, Myer pretty much tried to weasel out of this whole thing when it came to his statements to the press. But I could see how he might feel that this shouldn’t be his responsibility in the first place. Let the legal system dispense justice and if he is found guilty then dismiss him from his position.

I have no major problem with the boot it upstairs and let them worry about it, I did my job, defense. As long as he sees the next man up the line did their job too, and so on and so forth. When will Universities recognize that this is a serious subject and America will no longer tolerate it? 

No, my problem is with the lying.

It's unprofessional and morally wrong.

And worse IMO was premeditated. Maybe poorly thought out, but premeditated nonetheless. He's got to go for that reason. The integrity of the University is at stake. If not him then the man above him. Maybe both.

Logged
Definition of: Suicide wish; Self aware, independently self replicating. Tell me again why I need you humans around.

CaptainCargo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1374
  • I see you eyeballing that French girl
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #91 on: August 08, 2018, 01:42:05 PM »

ESPN (and others) saying Urban is not the victim, Courtney Smith is the victim and this should be about her.  What were the frickin police doing for the last three years? 

Did Urban Meyer know something first hand that the police were not already made aware of directly from Courtney? They arrested the guy, so I'm pretty sure they already knew about it.  They are required to do investigations right?    And if Smith had been fired while she was still living in the house would that have helped her or made it worse?
Check your facts.
Smith was never arrested.

Abusers often aren't. Doesn't mean they aren't guilty.
Do you ever read ESPN's posts for context, or just automatically respond?

My first impulse is to simply tell you to fuck off. But I'll bite my tongue.

Sigh, I know he was right that the guy wasn't arrested. I'm not the friggin moron you continually try to make me out to be.

I simply said not arrested doesn't mean not guilty. And as such indicate thusly that any reported abuse would be investigated as a matter of routine whether he was arrested or not. As a lawyer you know that.

So, even if the guy wasn't arrested the point/question of Scotty's post still stands notwithstanding his error on the non-arrest.


Personally Scotty has a good point. The guy was/is a danger to this lady. And really that is what all of this should be about and why any lying on Meyer's end cannot be tolerated. He's got to go. Anyone with an ounce of intelligence and integrity knows this to be true. Sycophants of course will disagree. Do you? 

You have often erringly called others here misogynists while implying that you aren't. It is now time for you to back that up as more than just talk. Step up or step off.
Fuck off.

I agree, always go with your first instinct.

Logged
Definition of: Suicide wish; Self aware, independently self replicating. Tell me again why I need you humans around.

Driver125

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 163
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #92 on: August 08, 2018, 01:52:08 PM »

Quote
The integrity of the University is at stake. If not him then the man above him. Maybe both.
I’ll say once again….Should the university officials be the ones to determine this mans guilt or should it be a court of law? Anything is possible should the only proof be one side’s allegations. At most suspend him until a court case is resolved one way or another.
Logged

CaptainCargo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1374
  • I see you eyeballing that French girl
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #93 on: August 08, 2018, 02:00:01 PM »

There are lots of people out there that 'get it'. And know why Meyer has to be fired by OSU. To do any less puts a stain on the University. Paterno did worse and needed to be fired. Probably should have been prosecuted. But Urban needs to go for the same basic premises.

https://1057thezone.iheart.com/featured/bruce-hooley/content/2018-08-04-meyer-lied-in-chicago-and-he-hasnt-stopped/

Urban Meyer’s social media apology for the lies he repeatedly told about a fired assistant coach's brush with domestic violence might have landed more believably Friday had Meyer not explained his actions with another lie just as fanciful.

“My intention was not to say anything inaccurate or misleading,” Meyer wrote. “However, I was not adequately prepared to discuss these sensitive personnel issues with the media, and I apologize for the way I handled those questions.”


Not adequately prepared?

Urban Meyer?

The man who has won 73 games in six seasons at Ohio State, and all three national championship games in which he has coached during his career, is rarely, if ever, unprepared.

No, what drove Meyer to the brink of precipitating his own firing by needlessly backing himself into a corner with lies told consistently and firmly at least nine times in three separate press conferences over a single afternoon was more likely an overabundance of forethought and planning.

There have probably been many press conferences during Meyer’s 16 seasons as a head coach at Bowling Green, Utah, Florida and OSU where he hasn’t been exactly sure of the initial question he would face.

But every Meyer media availability in Chicago carried the certainty of a first question related to the firing of his wide receivers coach, Zach Smith, the night before.

Meyer had one entire evening to confer with OSU crisis management experts and ponder how he would handle those questions about Smith’s dismissal.

Actually, Meyer likely had even longer to prepare, given that Smith’s firing had been a possibility since a report surfaced 11 hours before his firing that detailed his domestic violence issues in the past.[/] ...

...


Meyer’s supporters will, of course, defend this ludicrous excuse, just as they would laugh uproariously if Nick Saban, Jim Harbaugh, Mark Dantonio or any coach perceived as a threat to OSU’s on-field dominance positioned a similar fantasy as truth.[/]

...


“There was nothing,” Meyer said. “I don’t know who creates a story like that.”

For the better part of six hours, in front of a mass media gathering, again in a session with print reporters, and again in front of TV cameras, Meyer stuck to that outright denial and dismissive tone.

Here’s the exchange between Doug Lesmeresis of Cleveland.com and Meyer:

Lesmerises: “Are you saying you don’t know anything about that (2015 incident) or are you saying that never happened?”

Meyer shook his head as Lesmerises question began, as if to say  he indeed knew nothing about the 2015 incident. And then he said this:

Meyer: “I can’t say it didn’t happen, because I wasn’t there. I was never told about anything. Nothing ever came to light. I never had any conversation about it. So I know nothing about it.”

Five sentences...three outright, bald-faced lies.

A follow-up question from Lesmerises brought this from Meyer:

“The first I heard (about the 2015 incident) was last night.”

Another lie.[/] ...



Only time will reveal the exact reason Meyer chose the absolute worst possible way to handle questions he knew were coming. Most probably, it was his belief his lies would never be exposed, because both he and Ohio State and every big-time college football program are very good at shielding themselves from scrutiny.

If all this leads to Meyer's firing, it will be a mammoth misfortune, prematurely ending a career that could leave him looking down on every other coach in college football as the greatest ever in his profession.

It will damage Meyer’s considerable philanthropic impact in Columbus and stop his uncanny influence helping players realize their NFL dreams.

And if Meyer is fired, it will be entirely of his own doing, because he had the truth on his side and simply refused to tell it.

Meyer’s own social media mea culpa now contends he reported the 2015 Smith domestic violence matter to his superiors.

So why not admit that when questioned in Chicago?

Why not say, “I knew about the 2015 incident and I reported it to my superiors. I told Zach if anything ever came to light about that and it reflected on our program, he would be dismissed. That happened this week, and so we had to part ways.”

Would that revelation have brought the mighty Ohio State football program to its knees?

Would it have damaged Urban Meyer in any way that would have exposed him to a possible firing?

No and no.

So why did Meyer not tell the truth?[/]...


It wasn’t that he came to Chicago “not adequately prepared.” It’s far more likely Meyer had pondered the questions he would receive for the better part of 16 hours and was exceedingly prepared.

And probably exceedingly ticked off he’d have to shine some light on the dirty laundry in his program.

That’s why someone puts forth a false narrative and sticks to it resolutely while given repeated chances to tell the truth or correct his earlier lies throughout the day.

Meyer is rarely thrust into such situations, and it’s hard to envision how he could have handled it more deplorably.

While sycophants will excuse it as simply lying to the media -- a stupid defense, given reporters are the conduit to the general public -- there is an enormous difference between concealing which player will start at quarterback, or whether a tackle’s ankle injury has fully healed and repeatedly denying, and thus trivializing, domestic violence allegations against a staff member.

If Meyer doesn’t understand the difference, then his oft-stated core value of, “Treat women with respect,” rings as hollow as the only other core value he lists above that one, “Honesty.”
...
So you think lying to the media is.fireable if the topic is important enough, or if the coach is trying to avoid negative publicity?

Same people had Dantonio and Izzo lead off with nooses around their neck last year. Because having a "hot take" has become more important than a reasoned decision when all the facts are in.

Hot take my ass, the lying is totally unacceptable no matter how he wants to aww shucks it.

Of course I think what he did is a fireable thing. Frankly given the seriousness of the matter I'm surprised you don't. If you were that woman's lawyer, or brother, or that woman herself no doubt you'd think differently. If you actually think, actually buy, that Meyer was caught off guard gee whiz shit, well, I find that hard to believe. I guess I really don't know you at all.
To paraphrase Sherlock Holmes, it is a capital mistake to theorize without facts. You start to fit facts into your theory rather than come up with a theory that covers the facts. This is particularly true with you since admitting error is so difficult for you. When the story first broke you put yourself in a position where "fire Urban Meyer!" is the only acceptable outcome for you, regardless of what the facts will show.

Did Meyer follow the proper reporting policy? If the answer is yes, then your Old.West lynch mob mentality that decides, well, let's hang him for something else is not a mentality I choose to traffic in.

By the way, consider the possibility that our entire justice system has developed to remove the motivations of private vengeance as a factor. The question is not what would you want to do if it happened to you/your family member. The question is what is right. I get.that argument all the time when I discuss the death penalty. What would you want if it was your wife murdered, I get asked. I'd want a wooden post.sharpened and ramrmed up his anus and then raised up so that the weight of his body slowly works the post up to his vital organs causing him to die in unspeakable agony,.slowly. Preferably this soul take place at noon, and of July, in Gila.Bend.  THAT IS NOT THE POINT.

No, you miss the point as always when you defend The Big 10 with your no matter what mentality.

At the time of denial, he was guilty. He was obviously lying. And it was quickly proven that he was lying. He needed to go right then and there. So as the story went yes anyone would say fire him. Lynch mob my ass, he was dusted as far as I'm concerned as soon as the lie came out of his mouth and with the text corroborating that he was guilty. If I was an OSU booster I'd want him gone. You seem to think that since he apologized and admitted lying something has changed from that initial moment. Nothing changed for me and as I've posted a myriad amount of other people. 

I'm not talking law I'm talking the right thing to do. So don't bring your usual lynch mob bullshit lawyerspeak along to muddy up the water. That sort of sillyass bullshit you try never works on me ace. And as the story developed anyone should still say fire him. But maybe you don't have the moral center to really understand it. After all you are a lawyer.


Law? No need for that in this instance. The law doesn't say he can't lie and then later admit it. And the law doesn't say OSU can't fire him because of it. Lawyers are very good at talking out of both sides of their face. You dude, are a typical lawyer.

Logged
Definition of: Suicide wish; Self aware, independently self replicating. Tell me again why I need you humans around.

Espnthree

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 480
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #94 on: August 08, 2018, 02:00:35 PM »

Quote
The integrity of the University is at stake. If not him then the man above him. Maybe both.
I’ll say once again….Should the university officials be the ones to determine this mans guilt or should it be a court of law? Anything is possible should the only proof be one side’s allegations. At most suspend him until a court case is resolved one way or another.
There is no court case to be resolved.
Logged

CaptainCargo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1374
  • I see you eyeballing that French girl
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #95 on: August 08, 2018, 02:04:01 PM »

Quote
The integrity of the University is at stake. If not him then the man above him. Maybe both.
I’ll say once again….Should the university officials be the ones to determine this mans guilt or should it be a court of law? Anything is possible should the only proof be one side’s allegations. At most suspend him until a court case is resolved one way or another.

As to the blatant lying bro there is no question of his guilt. Is there? And that is where I base my 'fire him' stance. Others want to give him a pass, or a suspension.

Any of the people that want to give him a suspension defacto then agree with me. Namely that punishment is warranted.
Logged
Definition of: Suicide wish; Self aware, independently self replicating. Tell me again why I need you humans around.

Driver125

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 163
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #96 on: August 08, 2018, 02:23:21 PM »

Quote
There is no court case to be resolved.
If people are going to be fired and branded for life then there should be.
Quote
Namely that punishment is warranted.
Oh….I don’t know…..this sounds a little like the people who want to try and keep the old time concept of the student/athlete alive, when anyone who is looking at things in a realistic manner knows that the whole concept is only alive today in the movies. Everybody else who want to look at things in the way that they actually are today (particularly at the big-time football schools) knows that that stuff is dead and gone and is never coming back. Money-Money-Money….
Logged

Espnthree

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 480
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #97 on: August 08, 2018, 02:25:48 PM »

Quote
The integrity of the University is at stake. If not him then the man above him. Maybe both.
I’ll say once again….Should the university officials be the ones to determine this mans guilt or should it be a court of law? Anything is possible should the only proof be one side’s allegations. At most suspend him until a court case is resolved one way or another.

As to the blatant lying bro there is no question of his guilt. Is there? And that is where I base my 'fire him' stance. Others want to give him a pass, or a suspension.

Any of the people that want to give him a suspension defacto then agree with me. Namely that punishment is warranted.
“ Punishment is warranted”!
In other words it is Ohio State.
LOL
Logged

Yankguy1

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2576
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #98 on: August 08, 2018, 02:38:24 PM »

I sent my first payment off to Ann Arbor the other day and I'm now supposed to hate OSU.  So I'm staying out of this. 
Logged
You must try some of my purple berries.....

whiskeypriest

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1364
  • What does it matter? All is grace.
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #99 on: August 08, 2018, 03:16:13 PM »

Quote
As to the blatant lying bro there is no question of his guilt. Is there? And that is where I base my 'fire him' stance. Others want to give him a pass, or a suspension.

Any of the people that want to give him a suspension defacto then agree with me. Namely that punishment is warranted.
No, they don't agree with you, de facto or otherwise, because your position is not Meyer's conduct was wrong and deserves discipline, but that Meyer has to be fired, unless you do not have an ounce of intelligence or are a sycophant. THAT is just you working a different factual scenario into your previously stated "he should be fired" stance.
Logged
I like to think you killed a man. It's the Romantic in me.

CaptainCargo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1374
  • I see you eyeballing that French girl
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #100 on: August 08, 2018, 03:17:00 PM »

Quote
The integrity of the University is at stake. If not him then the man above him. Maybe both.
I’ll say once again….Should the university officials be the ones to determine this mans guilt or should it be a court of law? Anything is possible should the only proof be one side’s allegations. At most suspend him until a court case is resolved one way or another.

As to the blatant lying bro there is no question of his guilt. Is there? And that is where I base my 'fire him' stance. Others want to give him a pass, or a suspension.

Any of the people that want to give him a suspension defacto then agree with me. Namely that punishment is warranted.
“ Punishment is warranted”!
In other words it is Ohio State.
LOL

It is Ohio State what? Please be more clear on that statement.

If you think I'm saying it is OSU that should be punished you are wrong. They've, on the surface, done the right thing. So far. I can't speak for what has happened behind the scenes yet.

If you are implying that I'm saying that it is up to OSU to dole out the punishment, then yes. You are correct for a change. That's probably just a blind squirrel nut thing for you though.

But I suspect you meant the former, as you are usually wrong and way off base in your own inimitable opaque fashion.
Logged
Definition of: Suicide wish; Self aware, independently self replicating. Tell me again why I need you humans around.

whiskeypriest

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1364
  • What does it matter? All is grace.
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #101 on: August 08, 2018, 03:19:20 PM »

Quote
The integrity of the University is at stake. If not him then the man above him. Maybe both.
I’ll say once again….Should the university officials be the ones to determine this mans guilt or should it be a court of law? Anything is possible should the only proof be one side’s allegations. At most suspend him until a court case is resolved one way or another.

As to the blatant lying bro there is no question of his guilt. Is there? And that is where I base my 'fire him' stance. Others want to give him a pass, or a suspension.

Any of the people that want to give him a suspension defacto then agree with me. Namely that punishment is warranted.
“ Punishment is warranted”!
In other words it is Ohio State.
LOL

It is Ohio State what? Please be more clear on that statement.

If you think I'm saying it is OSU that should be punished you are wrong. They've, on the surface, done the right thing. So far. I can't speak for what has happened behind the scenes yet.

If you are implying that I'm saying that it is up to OSU to dole out the punishment, then yes. You are correct for a change. That's probably just a blind squirrel nut thing for you though.

But I suspect you meant the former, as you are usually wrong and way off base in your own inimitable opaque fashion.
I believe the third option is that your opinion that punishment is warranted is because it is OSU in the crosshairs. Which was my reading.
Logged
I like to think you killed a man. It's the Romantic in me.

CaptainCargo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1374
  • I see you eyeballing that French girl
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #102 on: August 08, 2018, 03:24:20 PM »

Quote
As to the blatant lying bro there is no question of his guilt. Is there? And that is where I base my 'fire him' stance. Others want to give him a pass, or a suspension.

Any of the people that want to give him a suspension defacto then agree with me. Namely that punishment is warranted.
No, they don't agree with you, de facto or otherwise, because your position is not Meyer's conduct was wrong and deserves discipline, but that Meyer has to be fired, unless you do not have an ounce of intelligence or are a sycophant. THAT is just you working a different factual scenario into your previously stated "he should be fired" stance.

Your post is pure bullshit, and sadly you are in asshole mode about this. So be it.

There are varying degrees of punishment. Fired is punishment. Suspension is punishment. If they support punishment then they defacto agree with me. The only difference here is the severity of the punishment.


Why you have to be a dick about it is, I suspect, because you are getting, as usual, the shitty end of the debate stick and you don't like it. Not my fault, get smarter.
Logged
Definition of: Suicide wish; Self aware, independently self replicating. Tell me again why I need you humans around.

CaptainCargo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1374
  • I see you eyeballing that French girl
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #103 on: August 08, 2018, 03:32:28 PM »

Quote
The integrity of the University is at stake. If not him then the man above him. Maybe both.
I’ll say once again….Should the university officials be the ones to determine this mans guilt or should it be a court of law? Anything is possible should the only proof be one side’s allegations. At most suspend him until a court case is resolved one way or another.

As to the blatant lying bro there is no question of his guilt. Is there? And that is where I base my 'fire him' stance. Others want to give him a pass, or a suspension.

Any of the people that want to give him a suspension defacto then agree with me. Namely that punishment is warranted.
“ Punishment is warranted”!
In other words it is Ohio State.
LOL

It is Ohio State what? Please be more clear on that statement.

If you think I'm saying it is OSU that should be punished you are wrong. They've, on the surface, done the right thing. So far. I can't speak for what has happened behind the scenes yet.

If you are implying that I'm saying that it is up to OSU to dole out the punishment, then yes. You are correct for a change. That's probably just a blind squirrel nut thing for you though.

But I suspect you meant the former, as you are usually wrong and way off base in your own inimitable opaque fashion.
I believe the third option is that your opinion that punishment is warranted is because it is OSU in the crosshairs. Which was my reading.

Then you are wrong in your belief. I understand you want to believe that. I know you can't fathom anything else as a reason. That's a personal issue you'll have to work out with yourself.

If past precedent is any indicator I won't be holding my breath that you can though.

I suspect it is because you find me a challenge that you just can't seem to master. Don't feel bad dude, coming in second is not a death blow. If you'd only not let your ego get the best of you most of these exchanges wouldn't escalate to the STFU stage.
Logged
Definition of: Suicide wish; Self aware, independently self replicating. Tell me again why I need you humans around.

CaptainCargo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1374
  • I see you eyeballing that French girl
    • View Profile
Re: College Football
« Reply #104 on: August 08, 2018, 03:33:20 PM »

I sent my first payment off to Ann Arbor the other day and I'm now supposed to hate OSU.  So I'm staying out of this.

Probably a good call on your part.


So how's the Michigan thing going?
Logged
Definition of: Suicide wish; Self aware, independently self replicating. Tell me again why I need you humans around.
Pages: 1 ... 5 6 [7] 8 9 ... 251