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How Should the Basketball "Topics" Be Arranged?

Knicks, NBA, College
- 3 (50%)
Knicks, Other Basketball
- 0 (0%)
NBA, College
- 1 (16.7%)
Basketball
- 0 (0%)
Leave it as it is
- 2 (33.3%)

Total Members Voted: 6

Voting closed: August 30, 2020, 02:57:14 PM


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Author Topic: Knicks  (Read 310817 times)

bodiddley

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #12855 on: August 13, 2020, 10:23:25 AM »

No, no I didn't.
I'd have no problem adding Bulldog Drummond in there, but he hasn't exactly had any impact on winning.  And somebody might be a T Ross fan (40% FG this year), but not me.

3 of the Top 5 picks were busts: #2 MKG; #5 ThRobinson; #4 Waiters Island
Two more midround washouts in Royce White & Kendall Marshall
From 18-33, the only player still in the Association is Fournier.

Everyone that I didn't mention is a career backup, Meyers Leonard and Au. Rivers types.  I know you're partial to Au Revoir, but he's a career 42% / 35% / 65% which is all low for a shooter who does little else (and I even rounded all of those up).  Was a starter one year for his Dad.

« Last Edit: August 14, 2020, 03:59:09 AM by bodiddley »
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lesterluv

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #12856 on: August 13, 2020, 11:17:24 PM »

Lillard just might get Melo another playoff appearance, win or lose, he is f'n ridiculous.....
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carlos123

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Don’t remind me
« Reply #12857 on: August 14, 2020, 12:41:45 AM »

Lillard just might get Melo another playoff appearance, win or lose, he is f'n ridiculous.....

Les, you don’t have to remind me that one was ours and the other shoulda been.

Donald Pandemic Trump defunding of the Post Office and planned theft of the Election is depressing enough.
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kiidcarter8

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #12858 on: August 14, 2020, 12:58:05 PM »

No, no I didn't.
I'd have no problem adding Bulldog Drummond in there, but he hasn't exactly had any impact on winning.  And somebody might be a T Ross fan (40% FG this year), but not me.

3 of the Top 5 picks were busts: #2 MKG; #5 ThRobinson; #4 Waiters Island
Two more midround washouts in Royce White & Kendall Marshall
From 18-33, the only player still in the Association is Fournier.

Everyone that I didn't mention is a career backup, Meyers Leonard and Au. Rivers types.  I know you're partial to Au Revoir, but he's a career 42% / 35% / 65% which is all low for a shooter who does little else (and I even rounded all of those up).  Was a starter one year for his Dad.


heh
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chipstern

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Bonkers
« Reply #12859 on: August 14, 2020, 03:14:36 PM »

Lillard just might get Melo another playoff appearance, win or lose, he is f'n ridiculous.....

That pull up jumper from Jerry West Territory was magical. 

I'll bet when Damian launched that ICBM, even Trae Young said, "Oh, come on now, dude." 

Ironic, that if Jerry West's infamous last second Uber-Clutch heave from mid court had come during the trey magnifique post-ABA Epoch, the Knicks probably would not have prevailed against the Lakers, as this trey would have iced our heroes, instead of simply sending up into overtime.   

I was in the common area TV Room of a college dorm when Mister Clutch hit that shot, and I mean, people just went bonkers. 
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bodiddley

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #12860 on: August 14, 2020, 03:50:36 PM »

My old friend Stanley Johnson with 23 in 23 minutes so far.  Some sweet drives then started dropping 3's over Bol Bol.  And his usual good D. 

Seems bubble announcing is worse than usual.  Maybe guys like Heinsohn and Leo Rautins didn't bubble up.   Scalabrine acted like he was on a podcast and spent a good 10 minutes laughing at Thomas Bryant for playing hard.  Ignoring much of the game.  They even came back and admitted they checked if he was up for a contract.
They had trouble understanding a guy just plays hard.  And another announcing team who didn't seem to know who Bryant was.  This is his 2nd season as a starter.
He's not obscure.

I don't know who is doing the announcing for TOR, but seems like some fan they pulled off the street, or out of a bar.  Seems like a lot of announcing teams want one guy to be a JVG type, acting goofy and showing enthusiasm.
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kiidcarter8

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #12861 on: August 14, 2020, 06:33:46 PM »

Scalabrine!!!

Funny guy.
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bodiddley

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #12862 on: August 14, 2020, 07:27:41 PM »

Vlade Divac out; Joe Dumars in as Kings' GM

I thought Vlade was overpraised at times and SacKings continued to do a mediocre job of developing guys or constructing a team. 

Hell, they drafted Bagley over Luka or Trae. 
And didn't have a 1st round pick last year.
I'd have to look more carefully how it all went down.
But Sacto still looks like one of those teams you poach useful young players from.
Like Giles or Bogdanovich or Hield.
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kidcarter8

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #12863 on: August 14, 2020, 07:32:18 PM »

Bagley's a good player

But (reportedly) like with Knicks - nobody wants to play in Sacto.
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kidcarter8

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #12864 on: August 14, 2020, 07:55:32 PM »

Fox was a solid pick.  And Blade got a good deal for DeMarcus

I give him a B over the 5 years
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bodiddley

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #12865 on: August 14, 2020, 09:50:25 PM »

Vlade's first move was hiring Joerger as coach.  Solid.

Flipped #8 pick Marquisse Chriss for Bogdanovich and Labissiere = good
Boogie Cousins trade was fairly good.  Needed to get rid of him and got a solid return (Hield, #10 pick, +)

2017 Draft
Fox was a good pick.
Flipped #10 pick Zach Collins for #15 Justin Jackson and #20 Harry Giles.
Vlade outsmarted himself with that one.  Zach is the best player; Just Jax hasn't panned out.  But Donovan Mitchell went #13 and Bam 14.
Can't be perfect, but Vlade could have added Fox and Mitchell.  Or Fox and Bam in one draft.

2017 - gave George Hill a 3/$57M deal to babysit the kiddie corps.  Hope Hill names one of his kids Vlade, at least as a middle name.
Signed an old Zach Randolph as a 2nd vet

2018 - drafted Gary Trent in the 2nd round, then traded him for a worse 2nd rounder in the next draft.   Oops.

Added Bjelica as a FA.
Traded nothing much for Harrison Barnes.

Luke Walton as head coach.
Bagley picked over Luka and Trae.

2019 Summer
overpaid for vets Cory Joe, Ariza, Dedmon, and own FA Barnes
Nice cheap Rich Holmes pickup
Signed Hield to a 4/$94M dealio!  So he's well-Hield now.

Traded Dedmon for Jabari and Len (I like, try some new guys, get out from a bad contract)


I like Vlad's coaching hires: Joerger and Luke.
Divacs was hit or msis on 1st round picks.
Vlad was very willing to make deals with his 1st round picks
Did well moving Chriss; muffed it with Zach/Mitch/Bam

(the 2017 pick disaster (Jayson Tatum!) was from a 2015 deal with PHI just before Vlade was hired and I can't figure out what the deal was all about -- offloading Landry and Jason Thompson's contracts(?).  SAC got the #5 pick which became Fox.  But SAC also lost their 2019 1st rounder in that deal (which became #14 Romeo Langford).  An odd non-Vlad deal.

Vlade tended to overpay old (Hill, Zach, Ariza), or marginal guys (Temple, Deadman).  Vlade had trouble building out a roster and seemed to go for names and vets over lower paid role players.  Lotta roster turnover + yute equals kind of a mess.

Paid a lot to keep Hield and Barnes, and while both have talent, they are overpaid.
Fox will command big money soon too.  Overpaid Hill and Dedman were moved shortly after signing.

So pretty hit or miss on picks and FA signings. 
Tended to overpo=ay vet FA and to retain his own guys.
I think all the $$ Hield and Barnes (and soon Fox) get will hamper the kings going forward. 

Vlade never built a team well.
A decided lack of defenders: Fox, Hield, Bogdanovich, Bjelica, Bagley.
Barnes okay on D; Cory Joe  plays D but is a backup; Rich Holmes crashes around and fouls alot.

I'd give him a C, maybe C+
« Last Edit: August 14, 2020, 09:58:25 PM by bodiddley »
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kiidcarter8

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #12866 on: August 14, 2020, 10:25:02 PM »

overpaid for vets Cory Joe, Ariza, Dedmon, and own FA Barnes



Because its Sacto

Lately he had been hell bent on keeping Bogdanovic, who could have netted picks

Picks = staying young

Keeping solid guys is your only hope
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bodiddley

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #12867 on: August 15, 2020, 05:29:11 AM »

Vlade recognized that they needed some vets to help the kiddies.
I just don't think there was much plan regarding fit and chemistry.
Two summers Vlade added rather scattershot vet additions.

Hill (3/$57M), Ariza (2/$25), Deadman (3/$40M) were all clear overpays and didn't work out there.  Cory Joe 3/$37M is a highly paid backup PG, but at least has mostly fit in.  But that's some cap space wasted.

Richuan the only 7 figure pickup I liked.  The type of cheap energy guy Vlade should have been hunting more of.  Vlade went for a lot of Garrett Temple, Tolliver type $8M guys.  A lot of guys who were never gonna help Sacto such as Shump and Alec Burks passed through.

Looks like they got nada for Cauley-Stein, just let him walk as a FA.
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bodiddley

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #12868 on: August 15, 2020, 10:09:28 AM »

Vlade is Serbian, as is assistant GM Peja Stojakovic, Chief Operating Officer Matina Kolokotronis and Peja Drobjnak.  The Kings Serbian contingent all know that corner of the world extremely well and speak the same language as Slovenian Luka Doncic.

One theory is that Vlade knew Doncic too well and didn't like his Dad:
https://sportsnaut.com/2019/11/report-vlade-divac-passed-on-luka-doncic-because-he-didnt-like-his-dad/

Hollinger has an article on Vlade and Doncic, but it's behind a paywall and hasn't spread on these here interwebs yet:
https://theathletic.com/1997870/2020/08/14/hollinger-on-vlade-divac-his-luka-miss-what-he-got-right-and-whats-next/

The official version:
Quote
There was ownership support for drafting Doncic No. 2 overall, but Divac, along with then-assistant general manager Brandon Williams and Stojakovic had concerns about Doncic's upside compared to Bagley’s, sources said.

As The Athletic reported last month, the belief that Doncic’s ball-dominance would limit Fox’s ability to grow and that they were better suited pairing him with a talented big like Bagley were driving forces behind the decision.

They failed to take into consideration that Luka was better than Fox, and you build around Doncic more than around Fox.  And that Luka would get their shooters -- Hield, Bogdanovich, Bjelica -- more open looks.

Maybe a Big like Divacs is partial to a more traditional balance of quick G and Big Man down low.
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bodiddley

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #12869 on: August 15, 2020, 11:23:56 AM »

Apparently that weird deal with the '6ers was Vlade's first move:

Quote
His initial trade that sent Nik Stauskas, Jason Thompson and Carl Landry to the Philadelphia 76ers cost the Kings two draft swaps and their 2019 first-round pick. The payoff was a one-season rental of Rajon Rondo.

The swaps basically resulted in losing out on Jayson Tatum but getting Fox.

This article isn't balanced, as it doesn't mention the Boogie trade, Barnes acquisition, decent Cory Joe pickup.
https://sports.yahoo.com/kings-vlade-divac-passing-luka-011756611.html
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