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Should the US be concerned about an invasion of Ukraine by Russia?

Very
- 6 (50%)
Some
- 4 (33.3%)
Not sure
- 0 (0%)
Not really
- 1 (8.3%)
Not in the slightest
- 1 (8.3%)

Total Members Voted: 11

Voting closed: February 15, 2022, 10:51:36 AM


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Author Topic: Biden Administration  (Read 652231 times)

Espnthree

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32415 on: January 03, 2023, 01:57:22 PM »


Of more concern to Ford is the increasing doubt over horseless carriages ever totally replacing horse-drawn vehicles.
The severe winter underscored a lot of problems, notably the obvious road surface problems and how we could possibly expect to power ALL carriages with gasoline we are not capable of producing. Add to that the tremendous built in inefficiency of an affordable nationwide fueling system.  Also of note: horselesss carriages are much harder to crank in harsh winter temperatures.  It is most likely Ford will dominate the automobile market, but we will need other technologies to ever totally replace the horse-drawn carriage.

Yeah, these problems just can't be solved by ramping up solutions in any practical timeframe.  I think Ford really is overenthusiastic about a technology that may just remain a pursuit of the most affluent.


Just like the fully autonomous cars that we were all supposed to be driving by now I think EVs  are just going to take longer to become mainstream than the media would like us to believe.
A silent majority in the auto industry share the view but they think it is the trend, so they cannot speak out loudly.
  CEO Akio Toyoda of Toyota

The Biden administration seems to believe that millions of Americans will rush out to buy electric vehicles if only the government throws enough subsidies at them. They are not and Tesla sales last year slumped badly.

The State of Maine told Federal Highway Administration this summer that cold temperatures will remain a top challenge for adoption, since  cold weather reduces EV range and increases charging times.
When temperatures drop to 5 degrees Fahrenheit, the cars achieve only 54% of their quoted range. A vehicle that is supposed to be able to go 250 miles between charges will make it only 135 miles on average.
At 32 degrees a typical winter day in much of the country a Tesla Model 3 that in ideal conditions can go 282 miles between charges will make it only 173 miles.


Imagine if  100 million Americans were driving electric cars over this past winter holiday. How many would have been stranded as temperatures plunged?

And, as many trade journals have pointed out, Federal funds also come with many rules, including
buy America  procurement requirements, which demand that chargers consist of mostly U.S. made components which could delay implementation by several years since only a few manufacturers can currently meet them. .
The State of New York New York says it will be challenging to comply with the web of federal rules, including the National Environmental Policy Act, the Americans with Disabilities Act, the Uniform Relocation Assistance and Real Property Acquisition Policies Act of 1970, and a 1960 federal law that bars charging stations in rest areas.

Oh, and labor rules. The administration requires that electrical workers who install and maintain the stations be certified by the union backed Electric Vehicle Infrastructure Training Program. New Mexico says much of the state lacks contractors that meet this mandate, which will reduce competition and increase costs.
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bambu.

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32416 on: January 03, 2023, 02:16:30 PM »

Indeed.
All of which shows that "renewables now" and "EVs now" are total folly.
Commonsense says:
"Build the infrastructure, first ...then introduce the EVs".
"Build the renewables infrastructure first, then close the fossil fuel generators".
« Last Edit: January 03, 2023, 04:52:17 PM by bambu. »
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Yankguy1

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32417 on: January 03, 2023, 02:23:20 PM »

The Biden administration seems to believe that millions of Americans will rush out to buy electric vehicles if only the government throws enough subsidies at them. They are not and Tesla sales last year slumped badly.

Any stats you can produce showing Tesla sales "slump[ing] badly"?  And despite what the cult of personality that Elon Musk has developed (welcome ESPN3!!!!), will tell you, more than ever TESLA EVS are hardly the only game in town.
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Hairy Lime

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32418 on: January 03, 2023, 03:26:07 PM »

The Biden administration seems to believe that millions of Americans will rush out to buy electric vehicles if only the government throws enough subsidies at them. They are not and Tesla sales last year slumped badly.

Any stats you can produce showing Tesla sales "slump[ing] badly"?  And despite what the cult of personality that Elon Musk has developed (welcome ESPN3!!!!), will tell you, more than ever TESLA EVS are hardly the only game in town.
Tesla has dominated the market, but I do not think they have built up enough base loyalty to continue to dominate as Euro manufacturers  like BMW on one end and Ford on the other move into the market.
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Oil Filter

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32419 on: January 03, 2023, 03:35:44 PM »

It is doubtful that the concept of battery heaters, for the northern tier of states, will ever make it off the drawing board, due to the massive technical challenges of making a device that can heat something.  There is also the absurd myth of "hydrogen combustion," where hydrogen is imagined as a "fuel" that could replace gasoline in an internal combustion engine.  Though some say the Hindenburg was in fact a case of hydrogen combustion, there is another side that sees phlogiston as the culprit.
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Yankguy1

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32420 on: January 03, 2023, 03:43:10 PM »

I don't see the word "sales" or "slumping" in the language you've quoted. In reality TESLA sales increased greatly in 2022 albeit by as much as either TESLA or Wall Street predicted. 

In any event, though, you still appear to believe that Teslas are the only EVs. 
« Last Edit: January 03, 2023, 03:45:45 PM by Yankguy1 »
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Yankguy1

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32421 on: January 03, 2023, 03:47:50 PM »

It appears you're attempting to argue that people are somehow souring on EVs.  Clearly' they're not.  People might not be as excited about TESLA as they once were.  There are plenty of reasons for that.
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Yankguy1

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32422 on: January 03, 2023, 03:50:03 PM »

Nice deletion there, ESPN 3.

I guess you're still trying to find that support for your assertion that TESLA sales "slumped badly" last year.
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Espnthree

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32423 on: January 03, 2023, 03:52:34 PM »

I don't see the word "sales" or "slumping" in the language you've quoted. In reality TESLA sales increased greatly in 2022 albeit by as much as either TESLA or Wall Street predicted. 

In any event, though, you still appear to believe that Teslas are the only EVs.
It is the only EV  manufacturer with full service in  a superior car.
But, as noted, sales of ALL EVs are slumping and the industry has been totally oversold
Electric cars may have a market in certain geographic areas but any idea they will replace gas driven vehicles is a foolish prediction.
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Hairy Lime

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32424 on: January 03, 2023, 03:53:15 PM »

There is also the absurd myth of "hydrogen combustion," where hydrogen is imagined as a "fuel" that could replace gasoline in an internal combustion engine.  Though some say the Hindenburg was in fact a case of hydrogen combustion, there is another side that sees phlogiston as the culprit.
I think i saw a documentary about that recently...
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Espnthree

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32425 on: January 03, 2023, 03:55:32 PM »

Nice deletion there, ESPN 3.

I guess you're still trying to find that support for your assertion that TESLA sales "slumped badly" last year.
The deletion was due to an ELBA glitch.

I will repeat it.




From the December17th edition of  of TIME


The tailspin in Tesla Inc. shares accelerated Tuesday, marking their longest losing streak since 2018, as a report of a plan to temporarily halt production at its China factory rekindled fears about demand risks.

Shares of the Elon Musk-led company closed down 11% at $109.10, for the seventh straight decline and its steepest one-day drop since April. The electric-vehicle maker s market valuation has shrunk to roughly $345 billion, below that of Walmart Inc., JPMorgan Chase & Co. and Nvidia Corp. This latest selloff also cost Tesla its position among the 10-highest valued companies in the S&P 500 Index, a distinction it had held since joining the benchmark in December 2020.
News of reduced output in Shanghai comes on the heels of last week report that Tesla was offering US consumers a $7,500 discount to take delivery of its two highest volume models before year-end, combining to intensify concerns that demand is ebbing. For Tesla, whose valuation is pinned on its future growth prospects, these worries reflect a significant risk.

Most of the stock weakness this year is due to indicators showing flagging demand globally,said Craig Irwin, an analyst at Roth Capital Partners. Tesla estimated revenue growth is still amazing, but not $385 billion market valuation type amazing, he said, referring to the value at the end of last week.


Tesla is the only real full service EV player since it has developed a network of charging stations tied to a GPS to guide its drivers to their destinations.

The other manufacturers do not.

But the overriding reason the EV future is overblown is that electric cars just are not as reliable for the distances Americans need in their cars and our electric grid is incapable of meeting the demand.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2023, 03:58:17 PM by Espnthree »
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Oil Filter

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32426 on: January 03, 2023, 04:03:18 PM »

It is clear that the flagging sales of the Maxwell Model Q indicate a downward trend in the current horseless carriage market that even Ford's much hyped Model T cannot stop.  Very likely the lack of paved roads and petroleum extracts will eventually point the market back towards horse drawn carriages and velocipedes. 

...I think i saw a documentary about that recently...

Heh. 
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Yankguy1

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32427 on: January 03, 2023, 04:10:21 PM »

Still nothing showing that TESLA sales "slumped badly" in 2022.    "ELBA glitch" or not. 
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Espnthree

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32428 on: January 03, 2023, 04:14:14 PM »

It appears you're attempting to argue that people are somehow souring on EVs.  Clearly' they're not.  People might not be as excited about TESLA as they once were.  There are plenty of reasons for that.

https://uk.motor1.com/news/627127/uk-electric-car-demand-waning-q4-2022/

England has set 2030 as the date to end gasoline powered cars.

Tesla is supplying huge discounts for its models but its stock is tumbling.
The US has huge tax incentives for EVs but no plan to produce the needed electricity.

The future of the EV age being pushed by governments.
The investors and the engineers are far less optimistic.
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Espnthree

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Re: Biden Administration
« Reply #32429 on: January 03, 2023, 04:17:09 PM »

Still nothing showing that TESLA sales "slumped badly" in 2022.    "ELBA glitch" or not.
Sure.
Tesla is offering $7500 per selected vehicle off the sticker and its stock keeps going lower.
Do you own either?
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