Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

Warriors

1 (33.3%)

Celtics

2 (66.7%)

Total Members Voted: 3

Voting closed: June 13, 2022, 11:38:11 PM

[bodiddley]

I'd prefer the 2 Losses.
<ducks>

Just 18 FT's combined.  Unusual.

I'm not completely against re-signing Morris.
A hard worker, some leadership skills. 
Note it was MaMo who called the player's meeting, not Randle.

3 outcomes:
trade Morris for some yute/picks
re-sign Morris
he walks in FA.

The latter is clearly a poor use of an asset.
Re-signing him could work out but means trying to rejig the team so Morris can settle in as a 2nd or 3rd option.  He's probably looking for a 4 year deal.  In his 30's.  Seems well-conditioned and a reasonably low injury risk.

Knix have to be listening to offers for Morris.
I'd like to get a promising yute or player and pick.

Does Morris even want to stay in NY (this year? for the future?).
Why would he?
We're a dysfunctional losing team that just fired it's coach while the front office is tottering.  I'd much rather get traded to a playoff team.  And I wouldn't re-sign in NY without a serious overpay.

Really I think we'd be doing Morris a solid getting him out of our morass.
 And getting him into the playoffs.  That's where you can really earn your next contract.  But winning is so much more fulfilling than losing.

Bottom Line:  I'd move Morris before he hits a slump.  A career 38% 3Pt shooter isn't going to continue to shoot 48% the rest of the season.  His value is never going to be higher.  And the sooner you trade him the more a playoff team gets out of him.  Since he's an ending contract.

[bodiddley]

Knix might be better off starting Elf.  But then you'd be running with 4 vets and one yute (RJB) in a 6-20 season.
Hard to see the benefit.  I'd rather more starts for the yute.

I guess you could swap in Mitch for Taj.
Elf- RJB - Morris - Randle - Mitch

Still get 2 yute starting.
And Barrett and Mitch arguably our two most valuable young'uns.
I'd be fine with that.

(and then Knox starts once you flip MaMo to a playoff team)

[facilitatorn]

They may not understand everything they need to do yet, but these players can be coached.

If our young guys, Frank, Barrett, and Knox hit some of the very nice wide open threes they got we would have been potent offensively. We blew some gimme layups as well.

I trust Miller to boost Frank and Knox as the season rolls on. When Payton finds his wind, I expect he will start and Frank will have an easier time as his backup.

In addition to stepping up as the offensive bell cow, Randle played some crazy good D in space.

Miller is quickly becoming my favorite Knicks coach in a long time.

[kiidcarter8]

How do we feel this morning about Frank's 6 mil extension?

[bodiddley]

Booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

[facilitatorn]

If we keep Miller and Frank gets to play all season with Payton, I expect we’ll feel very good about that extension when we have him for only 6 Mil next year. The bigger question is whether Dennis can be rehabilitated.

[bodiddley]

So I went to a park I used to play at and things have changed quite a bit.  About 6 months ago they set up a full body turnstile entrance/exit system, where you use your phone to scan an QR code which keeps track of how long you've been in the hoops area and charges you via phone accordingly.  Sort of like a high tech version of those old NYC subway full-body turnstiles.  Shanghai hoops goes high tech.

Hoops at the park used to be free.  I knew a number of guys who would be there all day every day it seemed.  So I'd always get in a game easily.  But now that's a bit expensive to do.  Charging per hour does cut down on the number of people there.   And the number who spend all day there.  So it's still easy to get in games.  But I hardly knew anyone there. 

Anyway, I'm mentioning this because in between the two courts they have these plaques in the ground with a handprint and sneakerprint for a handful of NBA players.  First one I check out is Scurry.  Pretty normal-sized.  Then the next one is  . . .  Dennis Smith Jr.  Huh?  Looks like he has real small hands.  My palms are regular sized but I have short fingers.  And so it seems does Jr. Smith.  We matched, or maybe my stubby fingers were a smidge longer.  Small hands are not good for dribbling.

It turns out that it was an Under Armour sponsored thing, and Smith Jr. is one of their lesser-celebrated clients.  They're probably regretting that decision.  The other two were Embiid and Mo Bamba.  Mo has large appendages.

So not only does the park charge an hourly fee, but they also get sponsorship money from a sneaker company.  (Btw, it only costs about $0.70 per hour)

What is up with Smith Jr?
Is he just not very good?
Not focused enough?
I thought he could at least be a Shroder type backup PG.
Maybe he should go to Gee-League for a spell (?)
Get reps as lead guard and rebuild confidence.
Better than inventing fake illnesses for him ...

[kiidcarter8]

Well, if you have seen him recently - no - not Shroder.

Hate to say it but his sloppiness is akin to the current Lonzo Ball, though of course LB is more talented.

Neither playing optimally. And neither getting desired minutes.

Shroder doesnt play as scattered as you think.

[bodiddley]

I was hoping Jr. Smith could become a quick, get-to-the-rack PG and develop a passable 3-point shot.  I really haven't seen Smith much on the Knix.
A few games I've seen him look real sloppy.  Some others he has flashed legit skills.

I wasn't really trying to knock Shroder, though he's a guy I don't trust.
But with what he does he's fairly effective, though not terribly consistent.

Give me a better comp or goal for Jr. Smith? 
Is he salvageable?  Or is this going to take a multi-year and multi-team rehab?
I was surprised he has a deal with Under Armour.  Probably signed it before he played his first NBA game.

Sure hope we hit on those #20 picks we'll get from DAL, because Smith Jr, DeAndrethe Giant and Wes Matthews sure didn't amount to anything knickwise.

When was the last good Knick trade?
Something involving Camby (?)

[bodiddley]

Well, Shroder is certainly available.
OKC has Shai-guy, their PG of the future.  CP3 and Shroder.
Right now Shai leads the Thunders in scoring (almost 19 per) which i didn't realize.
Shai, CP3 and Shroder are 3 of their top 4 scorers.
I doubt any team has ever had 3 PG's among their Top 4 scorers before.

Shroder just turned 26 to start the season.
Seems like he's been around forever.
This year, 3.4 assists to 2.6 turnovers.
He's a scorer with a weak 3 point shot (32.8%, just at his career average).
Shroder always seemed to me one of those guys whose confidence outmatches his skills.

Just with better focus and confidence, Jr. Smith should/could improve considerably.

[FWK00]

I'd prefer the 2 Losses.
<ducks>

Just 18 FT's combined.  Unusual.

I'm not completely against re-signing Morris.
A hard worker, some leadership skills. 
Note it was MaMo who called the player's meeting, not Randle.

3 outcomes:
trade Morris for some yute/picks
re-sign Morris
he walks in FA.

The latter is clearly a poor use of an asset.
Re-signing him could work out but means trying to rejig the team so Morris can settle in as a 2nd or 3rd option.  He's probably looking for a 4 year deal.  In his 30's.  Seems well-conditioned and a reasonably low injury risk.

Knix have to be listening to offers for Morris.
I'd like to get a promising yute or player and pick.

Does Morris even want to stay in NY (this year? for the future?).
Why would he?
We're a dysfunctional losing team that just fired it's coach while the front office is tottering.  I'd much rather get traded to a playoff team.  And I wouldn't re-sign in NY without a serious overpay.

Really I think we'd be doing Morris a solid getting him out of our morass.
 And getting him into the playoffs.  That's where you can really earn your next contract.  But winning is so much more fulfilling than losing.

Bottom Line:  I'd move Morris before he hits a slump.  A career 38% 3Pt shooter isn't going to continue to shoot 48% the rest of the season.  His value is never going to be higher.  And the sooner you trade him the more a playoff team gets out of him.  Since he's an ending contract.

Morris is one of those unusual late blooming NBA stars. Statistically and empirically he's been getting better for a number of years now. He really benefited from playing under Stevens in Boston.

IMO, the FO should -gasp- talk with him about the potential for sticking around.  I think he may have a good four solid, mature years in him.  If the contract is mildly front-loaded so that he's easier to trade as the contract goes, it might make good sense.

Any player this productive in NY has earned that consideration.  That said, of course, if an overwhelming trade proposal is made, its still a business but the Knicks need to build on success instead of trying to trade success for chances at elusive, superior lottery talent.

I can't say the same for Porter, Ellington, or Randle and certainly not DSJ. The caveat here is that Randle *has* looked more competent under Miller than Fizdale.

[bodiddley]

So far Randle has looked better against weaker disjointed teams.

Morris with his toughness does seem a NY kind of player.

[FWK00]

If we keep Miller and Frank gets to play all season with Payton, I expect we’ll feel very good about that extension when we have him for only 6 Mil next year. The bigger question is whether Dennis can be rehabilitated.

Fal and Bo,

I think DSJ is done as a Knick.  Its mostly a numbers game.  Payton and Frank, inconsistent as they can be, look to be the PGs who are kept on for a number of reasons, the most obvious being superior all round BBIQ and performance to DSJ based on this year's play.

The Knicks are looking to forge an identity and if that identity proves consistent with Coach Miller's reputation, the Knicks will be moving toward and implementing a much higher quality of defensive play.

Payton, Frank, and Allen all exemplify that quality.

Compounding that fact is the inevitability that trades and the lottery pipeline in the coming few years will provide ample opportunity to acquire yet another PG or two who, out-of-the-gate, will be more productive than *at least* DSJ.

Finally, you have to remember the Knicks are a basketball team that needs to start winning consistently.  DSJ isn't part of that chemistry equation. And, the Knicks are not a rehabilitation clinic that can lose game after game to nurse DSJ or anyone else's mystery ailments.

[FWK00]

So far Randle has looked better against weaker disjointed teams.

Morris with his toughness does seem a NY kind of player.

Bo, personally i would move Randall in a NY minute regardless.

But in fairness to Randall, he has looked better.  And while I think Sacto AND GS are not as good as the Knicks, they have both played much better than the Knicks this season (I know - not hard to do).  But I think both teams are strongly coached, were playing with no onus on their backs, and were absolutely ferocious in not wanting to get beat by the Knicks.

IOW, Randall,  instead of being the heart-stopping, turnover, bumbling fool of a PF we are used to actually turned in respectable performances.  Small consolation being better than no consolation.

And, yeah, Morris has a nineties kind of stickiness as a Knick.  I hope he weathers the storm.

[FWK00]

Well, Shroder is certainly available.
OKC has Shai-guy, their PG of the future.  CP3 and Shroder.
Right now Shai leads the Thunders in scoring (almost 19 per) which i didn't realize.
Shai, CP3 and Shroder are 3 of their top 4 scorers.
I doubt any team has ever had 3 PG's among their Top 4 scorers before.

Shroder just turned 26 to start the season.
Seems like he's been around forever.
This year, 3.4 assists to 2.6 turnovers.
He's a scorer with a weak 3 point shot (32.8%, just at his career average).
Shroder always seemed to me one of those guys whose confidence outmatches his skills.

Just with better focus and confidence, Jr. Smith should/could improve considerably.

There are a number of commodity PGs who could be had - Schroder being one.  But in my mind and to my taste, why waste our time  on  what amounts to be fairly pedestrian talent.

I'm warming to the idea of exploring trades for CP3.  Its a heavy lift and risky so the trade would have to really be self-insulating to some degree.  Something along the lines of Paul, Patton, and one of their coming first- rounders for Randall, Portis, and DSJ.

CP3 is a very expensive buy but may be exactly what the team needs to get through the next couple of years of maturity for Payton and Frank.  I don't imagine any summertime FAs migrating here in the next two summers and if CP3 gives the Knicks the boost they need I'd be very okay with that.

And because of his age this isn't a star-phuck trade IMO.  Just acknowledgement that NY can be home to superior basketball talent again.