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Warriors

1 (33.3%)

Celtics

2 (66.7%)

Total Members Voted: 3

Voting closed: June 13, 2022, 11:38:11 PM

[FWK00]

I’m on board with letting teams park players we can use at salaries they can’t bear on our books and using the change for a free agent or two.

Conely + 23 for DSJ or Payton + 38

They shave 25 mil at least off of Conely, get a look at someone they might go forward with, and a prospect they have to pay less in an uncertain draft.

Has only short term repercussions for us. In all ways but financial, to the good.

Yeah. Utah had some interest in Portis.

Portis, Ellington, DSJ, and 38 for Conley and 23 works.

[bodiddley]

Portis, Ellington, DSJ, and 38 for Conley and 23 works.

Sure they'll give us their starting PG and a 1st round pick for scrubs.
Nonsense.
_______________________________________________

So, uh, then who plays Point for Utah?
Mitchell?  Muddy?  Clarkson?  Jr. Smith?
You realize they're actually trying to contend.

And if UTA wants Portis, they could just wait for the Knix to drop his $15M option and then sign Portishead as a FA for under $9M using their MLE exception.
Which would save them $6M or more.
_______________________________________________________

UTA's cap is in good shape actually.
https://hoopshype.com/salaries/utah_jazz/
Conley and Gobert will be large ending deals. 
Mitchell still on his rook deal  -- just $5M next year.
Bogdanovich at $18M is reasonable.
Royce and Jingles on reasonable deals (around the MLE $9M level).

They'll need to decide on re-signing Gobert, which really comes down to what price.
And whether they bring back Conley on some much lower deal.  or find another starting PG.  Conley didn't mesh well in Y1, but unclear why and it turned out to be a strange year.  So another year to try to work it out is best for them, before deciding on his future there.

[FWK00]

Portis, Ellington, DSJ, and 38 for Conley and 23 works.

Sure they'll give us their starting PG and a 1st round pick for scrubs.
Nonsense.
_______________________________________________

So, uh, then who plays Point for Utah?
Mitchell?  Muddy?  Clarkson?  Jr. Smith?
You realize they're actually trying to contend.

And if UTA wants Portis, they could just wait for the Knix to drop his $15M option and then sign Portishead as a FA for under $9M using their MLE exception.
Which would save them $6M or more.
_______________________________________________________

UTA's cap is in good shape actually.
https://hoopshype.com/salaries/utah_jazz/
Conley and Gobert will be large ending deals. 
Mitchell still on his rook deal  -- just $5M next year.
Bogdanovich at $18M is reasonable.
Royce and Jingles on reasonable deals (around the MLE $9M level).

They'll need to decide on re-signing Gobert, which really comes down to what price.
And whether they bring back Conley on some much lower deal.  or find another starting PG.  Conley didn't mesh well in Y1, but unclear why and it turned out to be a strange year.  So another year to try to work it out is best for them, before deciding on his future there.

Well, I don't know what Utah is doing but not only is Conley being rumored but so is Gobert [to Boston, no less].

Now you can hate my trade but I don't think NY is trading for big contracts as a philanthropic gesture to other teams.

Utah was just sold to a bazillionaire so maybe they do just hang onto everybody and make another run.  Who knows.  But if they do reboot, Conley is an expensive, aging, shelf-life-expired kinda guy to be trying to trade.

Like it or not the Knicks are kind of exclusive in having the cap space potential to absorb these kinds of contracts.

Much as I admire your logic concerning the Knicks off-season, we ain't signing FVV.

And if observers like Hahn are correct, cap space will be used to park a body that won't be any of our first choices for veteran help.

[chipstern]

Portis, Ellington, DSJ, and 38 for Conley and 23 works.

Sure they'll give us their starting PG and a 1st round pick for scrubs.
Nonsense.
_______________________________________________

So, uh, then who plays Point for Utah?
Mitchell?  Muddy?  Clarkson?  Jr. Smith?
You realize they're actually trying to contend.

And if UTA wants Portis, they could just wait for the Knix to drop his $15M option and then sign Portishead as a FA for under $9M using their MLE exception.
Which would save them $6M or more.
_______________________________________________________

UTA's cap is in good shape actually.
https://hoopshype.com/salaries/utah_jazz/
Conley and Gobert will be large ending deals. 
Mitchell still on his rook deal  -- just $5M next year.
Bogdanovich at $18M is reasonable.
Royce and Jingles on reasonable deals (around the MLE $9M level).

They'll need to decide on re-signing Gobert, which really comes down to what price.
And whether they bring back Conley on some much lower deal.  or find another starting PG.  Conley didn't mesh well in Y1, but unclear why and it turned out to be a strange year.  So another year to try to work it out is best for them, before deciding on his future there.

Well, I don't know what Utah is doing but not only is Conley being rumored but so is Gobert [to Boston, no less].

Now you can hate my trade but I don't think NY is trading for big contracts as a philanthropic gesture to other teams.

Utah was just sold to a bazillionaire so maybe they do just hang onto everybody and make another run.  Who knows.  But if they do reboot, Conley is an expensive, aging, shelf-life-expired kinda guy to be trying to trade.

Like it or not the Knicks are kind of exclusive in having the cap space potential to absorb these kinds of contracts.

Much as I admire your logic concerning the Knicks off-season, we ain't signing FVV.

And if observers like Hahn are correct, cap space will be used to park a body that won't be any of our first choices for veteran help.

Afraid you are right. 

I am content to park bodies accumulate draft assets and facilitate trades. 

When Memphis wanted to dump Iggy, they added Crowder.  Not like Miami giving to JW wasn't a significant gimme, but still, being opportunistic is the way to go, like Jerry West and Red Auerbach.

Hey, when the Celtics let Olynek walk to sign Kyrie, BOOM, instant stretch 4 on the cheap. 

Likewise, Celtics signing Kanter on the cheap, more in keeping with his market value or lack thereof, and he gave them good minutes. 

As for our own free agent team options?  The draft will give us a clue. 

[bodiddley]

UTA's cap in is good shape.
Conley's making a ton of money at $34M but it's just for next year which Jazz are able to handle.  No need to dump him.
They need Conley at PG and don't need to move him to get under the tax.

They do need Conley to mesh with Mitchell.  On paper Conley was a nice fit.  Not sure why it wasn't smoother.  Though after a bad start, Conley came on strong before the stoppage.


The GoBear situation has a few elements. 
1) He's eligible for a super-max, and folks just don't pay C's that much anymore.  I'm pretty sure they want to keep Gobert but the price is key, as Mitchell will likely be a max fella in a few more years.  How much is an excellent defensive C who doesn't score much worth?  $20M?  $25M?  More?
2) The relationship with Mitchell and the team after Gobert acted like a jerk and got infected/infectious.  Has that been squared away?   

Bottom Line: PG is a key position in this league and Conley's money isn't a big issue for one more year for UTA.  Gobert is more about moving forward long term and the value/price of a C in the League these days.

[bodiddley]

I like the idea of collecting some assets for taking on a bad contract.
But teams mostly do that to avoid lux tax.  And that's not the case with UTA/Conley.  Dropping the final year of Conley just takes them out of contention without any benefit (except spending less).

That's why I mentioned Hayward.  He's useful to BOS and they'd like to keep him, but he's not essential and they are $17M over the tax line.  We could get them under.  Maybe Taj and Elf wouldn't be enough but they are useful vet role players  BOS could use.

I'll have to look for bad contracts on teams over the tax line.

[chipstern]

I like the idea of collecting some assets for taking on a bad contract.
But teams mostly do that to avoid lux tax.  And that's not the case with UTA/Conley.  Dropping the final year of Conley just takes them out of contention without any benefit (except spending less).

That's why I mentioned Hayward.  He's useful to BOS and they'd like to keep him, but he's not essential and they are $17M over the tax line.  We could get them under.  Maybe Taj and Elf wouldn't be enough but they are useful vet role players  BOS could use.

I'll have to look for bad contracts on teams over the tax line.

Hayward?

Christ, maybe we can McDyess while we are at it. 

[bodiddley]

I have us giving only Taj and Elf to get a guy who would be our best player.
It's just a one year ($34M) commitment.
And you figure things out from there.

The only thing it would do negatively is take a large bite out of our cap space.

I still think a hefty offer to FVV could/would work.
Say $24M.  Probably too much for TOR to match.
And FVV would have to think hard and long about turning down that kind of money and a chance to run his own team.  So what if it's a $6M overpay.  We'd have a legit starting PG (and one less $6M bench player).  If Fred is on board, you could structure it starting at $25M and dropping $1M a year.

[kiidcarter8]

Haliburton on Sirrius NBA Radio draft special today.

Confident kid.

Said to have told some that he feels he is the top player in this draft.

Warriors see Wiseman as appealing now.  Makes sense.

[kiidcarter8]

On Okoro - hosts said a kid has to be real freaking good to have NO SHOT and still be in the top 10.

Do we really want another jumpshot averse guy?

GREAT at everything else though.  And plenty ready for this level.

Edwards meanwhile painted as a bit of a baby (youngest guy in draft) - as in "do Steph and Klay really want to babysit a guy this year"?

Knicks'll do it.

[carlos123]

https://twitter.com/i/status/1322679224692604928



https://twitter.com/KingJames/status/1322688339426729985?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1322688339426729985%7Ctwgr%5Eshare_3&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fsports.yahoo.com%2Fbarack-obama-biden-michigan-campaign-3-pointer-233041292.html

[lesterluv]

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/31/us/politics/stanford-study-infections-trump-rallies.html

30,000 cases
699 deaths in addition to Herman
Most sadly, not all of these among attendees.
If only!

[bodiddley]

I've already noted that Okoro and RJB make a poor tandem.
We really need a guard or wing shooter.

WiseMan makes little sense when we have Mitch.
Toppin could apprentice under Randle a year, but drafting a poor defending PF is underwhelming.  At PF, I would take Okongwu, who is a beast.

WiseMan is a good fit for GSW, but do they really want to use their #2 pick on a C?
I wouldn't. Can't they just pick up Dwight, McGee, a Plumlyzeller type, or a Biyombo on the cheap?  Kanter and Len will likely be available for not much. Though they probably want a defender/lob target.*

Edwards could be a nice pick to both help now and build for the future. I like the Edwards pick if they flip Wiggins for Love. Add in Love as a vet rebounder, stretch 4. Then get the fresh legs and energy of Edwards, and just have one mistake prone scoring yute instead of two.   That's how I would go it.

* Here's an unlikely hypo:
Would folks be willing to trade Mitch & the #8 pick to GSW for the #2 pick?
NYK would get Ball or Edwards, a blue chip G.
We'd lose a very promising young defensive C to move up.
GSW would get a long defensive cog and rim assaulter.
Mitch could look terrific there.  A Mitch-Dray backline.
And they'd still get to draft a Vassell, Haliburton, Hayes type offender.
Could be a good deal for both teams. Provided Knix hit on the pick and get a future AS type.
Mitch & Vassell for Ball. Or Mitch & TyH for Edwards. Some permutation like that.
With the cupboard bare, can Knix afford to do a 2-for-1 to upgrade at G?
Any takers?

[kiidcarter8]

I've already noted that Okoro and RJB make a poor tandem.



Right.

But then I believe you gave your blessing to the pick.

I dont disagree.  I trust management/coaching staff (except maybe Woody - heh - just kidding).  And was pointing out that Okoro, even sans jumper, could be a winning cog immediately - and in time.

"If you build it, they will come, Ray".  The shooters will surely come.  Okoro would be BUILDING.

[bodiddley]

No, I've repeatedly said we need to draft a shooter.
Okoro isn't what we need.  Would be a mistake for NYK.

I'd love for Wise Man, Top Pin & O'Koro to all go ahead of us, so more shooters/scorers move down our way.

TyH has been still getting a good deal of praise.
Killian's rise seems to have peaked and he's now getting critiqued more.
(way left-hand dominant, not that great an athlete, etc)