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Warriors

1 (33.3%)

Celtics

2 (66.7%)

Total Members Voted: 3

Voting closed: June 13, 2022, 11:38:11 PM

[chipstern]

https://www.nba.com/stats/players/advanced/?SeasonType=Regular%20Season&sort=DEF_RATING&dir=-1&Season=2020-21&TeamID=1610612752

Not sure what that metric is doing, but doubt anyone thinks Rose, IQ, Burks  Knox, Obi were better defensively than Bullocks, RJB, Noel, Elf ... as it has there.

Eminently, Imminently Replaceable
*** good guy, not bad for team, no problem keeping him, just don't overvalue him...he's a placeholder

I've been saying we'd be better with Reg Bull on the bench unit.  But not sure how easy it is to replace him.  Knix have been searching for a starting 3&D SF/wing forever.  Lots of Courtly/Afflalos/Derrick Williams/Lance Thomas types have rolled through.  Reg Bullocks the best we've had.
I'd like a better starting 3&D SF.  But until we can get one, Bullox is valuable for NYK.

I agree

Would Iike to retain Reggie.

Thibs loves him.

In an ideal 🌎

He would come off the bench to.key a second unit.

Knicks picks anticipate possibility that minimally, Reggie and Nerlens could be moving on.  Rose, too.  Hope not, because Rose at 10,000,000 x 2 would be a great mentor sixth man for Quickley, Vildoza and McBride.

Payton is toast.  Frank might have a second act if he would reup.for Peyton 💰

Thibs lobbied hard for Grimes and especially McBride.

I was pulling for Butler, who went at #40 to the Pelicans.

This draft had Thibs and Aller written all over it.

Wonder if we pursue a 3&D in free agency.

Not sure Fournier is IT.  Am pretty sure Oubre is NOT.

We shall see.

PS: Fascinated by Jericho at at #58.  Sumner league should be interesting. 

[chipstern]

I thought he ended up a Pelican.

Now I read he's on Utah.

Good landing spot.

Thibs preferred McBride.

We'll know soon enough.

[lesterluv]

Not sure what that metric is doing.....

Can't help you if you don't understand advanced statistics.

Luckily, the EYE TEST suffices quite well!

*** the decades-long search to find a Reggie Bullock lmao

Nice player, love the guy, belongs on the bench, 10 mins max, you'll never be great if he's starting, do not overpay under ANY CIRCUMSTANCE, looks like we picked up a guy who's got a shot to eventually replace him, somebody has to if we're gonna ELEVATE, GREAT!

Bottom line: Reg is a very LIMITED player. I love the stuff he does well. But there is so much stuff HE CANNOT DO AT ALL. So dangerous to overvalue. Now this guy - if he can take his stuff to next level and continue to evolve, different story, we'll see: https://youtu.be/nf609L6NmvU

[luee]

I hope to not see Franky, KK, and Obi ever again in blue and orange.

[lesterluv]

Funny, I am really looking forward to seeing more Obi next year.
*** though he may be better served developing with a different team, if he does end up as part of a trade package

I don't expect to see Franky again, but am fine with it if I do.

Knox? He's been offending my eyes for years, but last season not so much. Happy to see him again if he returns.

[facilitatorn]

I thought he ended up a Pelican.

Now I read he's on Utah.

Good landing spot.

Thibs preferred McBride.

We'll know soon enough.

Butler had a red flag on each knee. It’s why he dropped. If he stays healthy he can make teams regret passing on him.

I’m very glad Bryant and Payne both decided to stay on staff.

I like that we’re going into free agency with a 1A & 1B in the fold with Randle and Barrett and at least a playable stopgap at all the other positions.

To a guard or wing free agents, the Knicks should look pretty attractive.

[chipstern]

Funny, I am really looking forward to seeing more Obi next year.
*** though he may be better served developing with a different team, if he does end up as part of a trade package

I don't expect to see Franky again, but am fine with it if I do.

Knox? He's been offending my eyes for years, but last season not so much. Happy to see him again if he returns.

Frank is due a qualifying offer from the Knicks of $8.2

Not sure how it works, but is it possible we could tender him an extension for less money?  Apparently, from poop on the scoop, consensus amongst Knicks brass is not of a piece with Luee's OFF WITH THEIR HEADS edict. 

Whether they got significant minutes or not, considerable development work was invest in Frank, Kevin and Obi last year, and I do not believe it is a given that they are naught but trade bait.  ALL SHOWED IMPROVEMENT.  How they stack up in future plans?  We will have a better idea come next week. 

[chipstern]

Communicate intermittently with our Elba Alumni. 

I usually touch bases with him on  draft night, as his passion burns like lava from Vesuvius, and inevitably, the Knicks find some way to utterly confound him. 

When the Knicks were offloading their first rounders, he began to melt down, and I bore witness, unable to decipher the method in Leon's madness, or for that matter, to state with any certainty that it wasn't sheer madness. 

Discovering that the Charlotte #1 pick for 2022 we received back for our #19 was Top 18 protected, I kept waiting for the other shoe to drop.  As in, there must be a player involved, or another pick [much as a 2024 #2 pick from the Clippers, received again from Detroit in the Blake Griffin trade], but no. 

It wasn't until we picked Quentin Grimes at #25 [in lieu of our #21] that I exhaled a little, though I remained confounded by why the exchange with the Hornets was so seemingly one sided. 

Still, it appeared as though, since Grimes had been reported to be very much on THIBS' radar, that McBride was similarly in our sites.  When the #32 was traded, we both kind of shook our heads. 

"LOL...Leon Rose is some mad stupid scientist.  I'm so f****** confused."   

[chipstern]

QUENTIN GRIMES

POSITION: G
HEIGHT/WEIGHT: 6-5 / 205 lbs
SCHOOL/CLUB Houston
COUNTRY: USA
STATUS: Junior
BIRTHDAY: 05/08/2000


STRENGTHS
• Quality shooter with a strong frame and solid feel.
• Has outstanding form and mechanics on his jumper.
• Plays with very good pace; knows how to get open.
• Solid vision and playmaking skills.

PERSONAL
• 2019-20 AAC All-Academic Team selection.
• Father, Marshall, played college basketball at Santa Clara and Louisiana.
• Brother, Tyler Myers, has played 12 seasons in the NHL.

Grimes made an AAC-high 3.33 three-pointers per game in 2020-21, eighth most in NCAA Division I


ROKAS JOKUBAITIS


POSITION: G
HEIGHT/WEIGHT: 6-4 /194 lbs
SCHOOL/CLUB: Zalgiris Kaunas (Lithuania)
COUNTRY: Lithuania
STATUS: International
BIRTHDAY: 11/19/2000

STRENGTHS
• Combo guard with superior offensive craft.
• Capable long- and mid-range shooter.
• Has outstanding court vision; makes good reads.
• Very effective in pick-and-roll situations.

PERSONAL
First gained media attention in the U.S. after scoring 31 points for Zalgiris 2 in LaMelo Ball’s pro debut with Vytautas Prienu in Lithuania on Jan. 9, 2018.


MILES MCBRIDE

POSITION: G
HEIGHT/WEIGHT: 6-2 /200 lbs
SCHOOL/CLUB: West Virginia
COUNTRY: USA
STATUS: Sophomore
BIRTHDAY: 09/08/2000

STRENGTHS
• Sturdy combo guard with excellent defensive potential
• Elite on-ball defender with a ball-hawk mentality
• Versatile scorer who can create his own shot
• Good touch on mid-range jumper; has three-point range.

PERSONAL
• 2020-21 Academic All-Big 12 Second Team choice
• 2019-20 Academic All-Big 12 Rookie Team pick
• Standout high school quarterback
• High school basketball teammate of the Pelicans’ Jaxson Hayes
• Father, Walt, played basketball at Xavier
• Mother, Kim, played tennis at Ohio State


JERICHO SIMS

POSITION: C
HEIGHT/WEIGHT: 6-10/245 lbs
SCHOOL/CLUB: Texas
COUNTRY:USA
STATUS: Senior
BIRTHDAY: 10/20/1998

STRENGTHS
• Outstanding combination of size and athleticism.
• Aggressive and bouncy around the rim.
• Solid instincts and timing as a rim protector.
• Can switch and guard on the perimeter.

PERSONAL
• Majored in African & African Diaspora Studies with a minor in Anthropology at Texas.
• Father, Charles, played basketball at the University of Minnesota.
• Has five older brothers, two of whom played Division I college basketball and one of whom played D-1 college football.

Sims’ 44.5-inch max vertical jump at the 2021 NBA Draft Combine tied for the third-highest jump in event history.

[Kam]

Communicate intermittently with our Elba Alumni. 

I usually touch bases with him on  draft night, as his passion burns like lava from Vesuvius, and inevitably, the Knicks find some way to utterly confound him. 

When the Knicks were offloading their first rounders, he began to melt down, and I bore witness, unable to decipher the method in Leon's madness, or for that matter, to state with any certainty that it wasn't sheer madness. 

Discovering that the Charlotte #1 pick for 2022 we received back for our #19 was Top 18 protected, I kept waiting for the other shoe to drop.  As in, there must be a player involved, or another pick [much as a 2024 #2 pick from the Clippers, received again from Detroit in the Blake Griffin trade], but no. 

It wasn't until we picked Quentin Grimes at #25 [in lieu of our #21] that I exhaled a little, though I remained confounded by why the exchange with the Hornets was so seemingly one sided. 

Still, it appeared as though, since Grimes had been reported to be very much on THIBS' radar, that McBride was similarly in our sites.  When the #32 was traded, we both kind of shook our heads. 

"LOL...Leon Rose is some mad stupid scientist.  I'm so f****** confused."

The Knicks tried like hell to move up in the draft using the 19 and the 21.  Finding no takers they went to plan B and identified Grimes and McBride and correctly assessed where those two would be slotted in the draft.  It would have been a less than optimal use of the 19 and the 21 to draft Grimes and McBride.  So rather than  "reach" at 19 for a guy they could get much later they traded the pick for something roughly equivalent next year with a 3 year window to use that asset for another deal rather than watch their 3 minute window on that asset close when they were on the clock.   That's nothing if not genius if you ask me.  We created another first round pick out of thin air.

Similar story with the 21 pick... trade back for more assets and still get McBride.  So 21 became 25 and a future #2.   25 became Grimes (the guy they didn't reach for at 19) and they have a high 2nd round pick in the future from Detroit.  Speaking of Detroit the 32 pick was originally their selection, and with the 32 they traded back and got Rokas AND McBride.

So leaving Sims aside the Knicks went into the draft with three high picks 19,21,32 and they left with their two Plan B targets as well as a future Charlotte first, Detroit 2nd, and a stashed Rokas to add to their list of trade assets.  Simply put, they changed 3 assets into 2 players and 3 assets.

I can understand being confused when the picks were happening and the Knicks kept trading back, but I cannot understand any anger or frustration.  We saw what the braintrust was able to do last year in the draft trading back and nabbing IQ at 25.   The benefit of the doubt was in play.   

[chipstern]

Communicate intermittently with our Elba Alumni. 

I usually touch bases with him on  draft night, as his passion burns like lava from Vesuvius, and inevitably, the Knicks find some way to utterly confound him. 

When the Knicks were offloading their first rounders, he began to melt down, and I bore witness, unable to decipher the method in Leon's madness, or for that matter, to state with any certainty that it wasn't sheer madness. 

Discovering that the Charlotte #1 pick for 2022 we received back for our #19 was Top 18 protected, I kept waiting for the other shoe to drop.  As in, there must be a player involved, or another pick [much as a 2024 #2 pick from the Clippers, received again from Detroit in the Blake Griffin trade], but no. 

It wasn't until we picked Quentin Grimes at #25 [in lieu of our #21] that I exhaled a little, though I remained confounded by why the exchange with the Hornets was so seemingly one sided. 

Still, it appeared as though, since Grimes had been reported to be very much on THIBS' radar, that McBride was similarly in our sites.  When the #32 was traded, we both kind of shook our heads. 

"LOL...Leon Rose is some mad stupid scientist.  I'm so f****** confused."

The Knicks tried like hell to move up in the draft using the 19 and the 21.  Finding no takers they went to plan B and identified Grimes and McBride and correctly assessed where those two would be slotted in the draft.  It would have been a less than optimal use of the 19 and the 21 to draft Grimes and McBride.  So rather than  "reach" at 19 for a guy they could get much later they traded the pick for something roughly equivalent next year with a 3 year window to use that asset for another deal rather than watch their 3 minute window on that asset close when they were on the clock.   That's nothing if not genius if you ask me.  We created another first round pick out of thin air.

Similar story with the 21 pick... trade back for more assets and still get McBride.  So 21 became 25 and a future #2.   25 became Grimes (the guy they didn't reach for at 19) and they have a high 2nd round pick in the future from Detroit.  Speaking of Detroit the 32 pick was originally their selection, and with the 32 they traded back and got Rokas AND McBride.

So leaving Sims aside the Knicks went into the draft with three high picks 19,21,32 and they left with their two Plan B targets as well as a future Charlotte first, Detroit 2nd, and a stashed Rokas to add to their list of trade assets.  Simply put, they changed 3 assets into 2 players and 3 assets.

I can understand being confused when the picks were happening and the Knicks kept trading back, but I cannot understand any anger or frustration.  We saw what the braintrust was able to do last year in the draft trading back and nabbing IQ at 25.   The benefit of the doubt was in play.

I agree KAM. 

Miras is very emotional, and it took a little while for the sense of things to reveal itself. 

Yes, having been shut out of the TOP TIER TARGETS, Rose zeroed in on the SECOND TIER.  It was well played. 

Charlotte obviously played hard ball.  Top 18 as opposed to Top 14?  There is a likelihood they WILL make the playoffs if everyone is healthy.  And with Bouknight joining the back court rotation of Ball, Rozier, Graham and Monk, they have a good shot at the playoffs. 

As for Detroit's #2 in 2024?  I would not count on that being too tasty.  They had a great draft last year and THIS YEAR. 

AS FOR OUR KNICKS? [Berman's Take]

The protection on Charlotte’s 2022 first-round pick they gained Thursday is pretty severe. It’s protected up to 18 in 2022 — which means there’s a likely chance it won’t be conveyed. In 2023, it’s protected until 16. It’s protected up to 14 in 2024 and 2025. So the Knicks will need the Hornets to make the playoffs soon or they’ll be owed two second-round picks in 2026.

The one current benefit of giving up 19 for the future was saving $2.7 million in salary-cap space. The Knicks should have about $50 million in space as they seek a starting point guard.

The likelihood is the Knicks will have six first-rounders and nine second-rounders over the next four drafts.

[chipstern]

Hawks getting Sharife Cooper at #48 was a gift from the basketball Gods. 

He is a poor man's/mini-me jet ski reflection of Trae.  He is going to be groomed to be Trae Bien's understudy.

AND AS PER BO-D...

Hawks pick at #20, 6'9" Jalen Johnson of Duke, might just be the 3&[Bo]D that our resident handicapper cherishes.  We shall see. 

Hawks are going to be very tough next season.  They have really done well for themselves in remaining patient and buillding through the draft, while adding key vet pieces in Capella, Sweet Lou, Gallo and Bogdonavich through trades and FA. 

Leon should only do so well. 

[chipstern]

Was glad to see that Facil had some experience of and enthusiasm FOR our #58 pick, JERICHO SIMS. 

There was a very funny clip Kendrick Perkins played of JERICHO dunking in a game and getting up so high that his eyebrow knocked up against the rim.  His hops are serious. 

As for our eternal pursuit of the 3&D, Chip Stern's JARED HARPER MEMORIAL REACH for 2021 is....

AAMIR SIMS, an unrelated, undrafted forward out of Clemson.

The 6'8" two-time All-ACC honoree averaged double figures his junior and senior years, seasons he also made 40% of his 3-pointers. Sims did some of everything, becoming only the fourth Tiger ever with at least “1,000 points, 600 rebounds, 150 assists, 75 steals and 75 blocks in a career — joining Trevor Booker, Horace Grant and Larry Nance.” Those three combined to play 38 years in the NBA. Could Sims turn out to be a long-running big man, too? Maybe. You can see someone who might be able to do some damage as a combo forward off the bench — strong enough to attack non-jumbo 3s, with the speed and range to exploit certain slower 4s.

[Kam]

Communicate intermittently with our Elba Alumni. 

I usually touch bases with him on  draft night, as his passion burns like lava from Vesuvius, and inevitably, the Knicks find some way to utterly confound him. 

When the Knicks were offloading their first rounders, he began to melt down, and I bore witness, unable to decipher the method in Leon's madness, or for that matter, to state with any certainty that it wasn't sheer madness. 

Discovering that the Charlotte #1 pick for 2022 we received back for our #19 was Top 18 protected, I kept waiting for the other shoe to drop.  As in, there must be a player involved, or another pick [much as a 2024 #2 pick from the Clippers, received again from Detroit in the Blake Griffin trade], but no. 

It wasn't until we picked Quentin Grimes at #25 [in lieu of our #21] that I exhaled a little, though I remained confounded by why the exchange with the Hornets was so seemingly one sided. 

Still, it appeared as though, since Grimes had been reported to be very much on THIBS' radar, that McBride was similarly in our sites.  When the #32 was traded, we both kind of shook our heads. 

"LOL...Leon Rose is some mad stupid scientist.  I'm so f****** confused."

The Knicks tried like hell to move up in the draft using the 19 and the 21.  Finding no takers they went to plan B and identified Grimes and McBride and correctly assessed where those two would be slotted in the draft.  It would have been a less than optimal use of the 19 and the 21 to draft Grimes and McBride.  So rather than  "reach" at 19 for a guy they could get much later they traded the pick for something roughly equivalent next year with a 3 year window to use that asset for another deal rather than watch their 3 minute window on that asset close when they were on the clock.   That's nothing if not genius if you ask me.  We created another first round pick out of thin air.

Similar story with the 21 pick... trade back for more assets and still get McBride.  So 21 became 25 and a future #2.   25 became Grimes (the guy they didn't reach for at 19) and they have a high 2nd round pick in the future from Detroit.  Speaking of Detroit the 32 pick was originally their selection, and with the 32 they traded back and got Rokas AND McBride.

So leaving Sims aside the Knicks went into the draft with three high picks 19,21,32 and they left with their two Plan B targets as well as a future Charlotte first, Detroit 2nd, and a stashed Rokas to add to their list of trade assets.  Simply put, they changed 3 assets into 2 players and 3 assets.

I can understand being confused when the picks were happening and the Knicks kept trading back, but I cannot understand any anger or frustration.  We saw what the braintrust was able to do last year in the draft trading back and nabbing IQ at 25.   The benefit of the doubt was in play.

I agree KAM. 

Miras is very emotional, and it took a little while for the sense of things to reveal itself. 

Yes, having been shut out of the TOP TIER TARGETS, Rose zeroed in on the SECOND TIER.  It was well played. 

Charlotte obviously played hard ball.  Top 18 as opposed to Top 14?  There is a likelihood they WILL make the playoffs if everyone is healthy.  And with Bouknight joining the back court rotation of Ball, Rozier, Graham and Monk, they have a good shot at the playoffs. 

As for Detroit's #2 in 2024?  I would not count on that being too tasty.  They had a great draft last year and THIS YEAR. 

AS FOR OUR KNICKS? [Berman's Take]

The protection on Charlotte’s 2022 first-round pick they gained Thursday is pretty severe. It’s protected up to 18 in 2022 — which means there’s a likely chance it won’t be conveyed. In 2023, it’s protected until 16. It’s protected up to 14 in 2024 and 2025. So the Knicks will need the Hornets to make the playoffs soon or they’ll be owed two second-round picks in 2026.

The one current benefit of giving up 19 for the future was saving $2.7 million in salary-cap space. The Knicks should have about $50 million in space as they seek a starting point guard.

The likelihood is the Knicks will have six first-rounders and nine second-rounders over the next four drafts.

Here is the other benefit of the trade for the Knicks ... Charlotte can't trade a First until 2027.   So if over the next 3 or 4 years they want to trade a first they'll have to come to the Knicks first and offer the Knicks something just to remove the protections.   

[chipstern]

So...

What is the consensus?

Wish Lists, notwithstanding....

Who MIGHT the Knicks be targeting among their own free agents, and free agents coming on to the market in an admittedly thin class. 

NOTE: No Damian Lillard.  No Bradley Beal.  No Kawhi Leonard. 

MY SENSE OF THINGS: Again, the draft [and the free agent signings of Luka Vildoza and Aamir Sims] was revealing as to how the Knicks may or may not proceed in looking to reup, sign and trade or wave goodbye to Rose, Bullock, Burks and Noel.  Or how the Knicks move forward with their puppies, IQ, Knox and Toppin, whether we view them as developmental pieces or as trade assets.  Given how Rose and Aller and Perry proceeded through the draft, I'm wondering if they might not be laying in wait through free agency to take advantage of bargains in buyouts, salary dumps, sign and trades. 

I do not see any clear cut targets.  I think Sexton was a media blogosphere pipe dream.  I'm not sure there is a consensus on Lonzo Ball though he would be a target if I had my druthers.  Fournier or Oubre for 15-20 million?  Am I missing anything.  I do not see any clear cut targets.  Again, I think Leon is positioned to be opportunistic, which precludes the likes of Paul or Conley [who are far far more likely to receive significant offers from their hometown teams].  Scroheder?  Dimiwiddie?  Will be looking for Van Vleet money. 

As per the Rose-Aller-Perry close to the vest, reveal nothing approach, their show card reveals nothing of the cards they are holding. 

That salary cap money we gleaned from the Porzingis Trade is being held on to like the healing waters of Lourdes.  Derrick Rose.  Julius Randle.  Mitchell Robinson.  At the head of the cafeteria lunch line.