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Warriors

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Total Members Voted: 3

Voting closed: June 13, 2022, 11:38:11 PM

[chipstern]

When I first dared, DARED, to say I did not want Thibs coaching this team any more, most here if not all, were against that notion, most eloquently Chief Chip.

I am proud to have been the first. I bet nobody here now would be terribly upset were Thibs let go. And I bet players would feel relieved and ready for a fresh start.

OFF WITH HIS HEAD ALREADY!!!

NONSENSE

Number One, I have issues with Thibs, but letting him go will not facilitate success but further chaos. 

Number Two, giving you the benefit of the doubt, let's assume, quite rightly, that you are not a moron, but have a rather pronounced sense of humor, as evidenced by your stubborn insistance on the efficacy of a career white bread scrub as the answer to the question no one has broached.  Never mind, genius, that firing Thibs would not necessarily engender a gold rush of talented coaches to flock to the shit storm that is the NYC Fan Base.  Having said THAT, worth remembering that the Knicks fired Don Nelson and replaced him with assistant Jeff Van Gundy, which worked out okay.  But then, HOWEVER, Nellie's sin, was to try and write Patrick Ewing out of the narrative.  DUH. 

Number Three, in 2020-2021, everything Leon & Thibs touched, turned to gold.  In 2021-2022, many of their decisons have come back to bite us on the ass.  Julius is in a dark place, playing well below his talent level, seemingly damned if he does, damned if he don't, miscast as a ballet dancer, point forward, when he is actually an offensive tackle power forward, passing up shots to as Thibs might have it, "Make plays."  Kemba was a sentimental reach that most of us applauded, and which has blown up in our face.  Nerlens can't stay healthy.  Burks is a sixth man tasked with being the main man, for which he is miscast. 

Taj has been a pro's pro. And short of going down for two months, Rose has been a solid sender, and A LEADER, and it is that leadership which we most sorely miss.    

Number Four, while everyone, including me, is freaking the fuck out, it is USEFUL TO REMEMBER, when you are congragulating yourself for being in the front lines calling for Thibs head, that Coach's ' stubborn streak and quirky rotations notwithstanding, WE HAVE A SOLID CORE OF YOUTH, and Thibs has been developing them.  Under Thibs' watch, we have seen a coming of age of Mitchell [C], Obi [PF], RJ [SF], Grimes [SG] and IQ [PG], which in case you haven't noticed, IS A TENABLE ROTATIONAL QUINTET.  And while we all lambast Thibs for sticking with his vets, when our puppies get an opportunity, Jericho and Deuce and Cam have shown solid flashes of talent and tenacity, and you better believe that they are going to get longer looks if our starting five cannot get it together.  We have drafted well, have the likes of a Rokas Jokubaitis on ice, ripening on the vine in Spain, have good draft assets, expiring contract/third year options for Walker, Rose, Gibson, Noel, Burks coming due in 2023.  We also, OF COURSE, have long term commitments to Randle and Fournier...we shall see how THAT plays out.   

[elephant]

Aside from Randle's woes, what is going on with the offense? Is it really a talent thing? For better ball clubs, it's clear about their strategies to confuse defenses, exploit weakness, so on. For us, it's a mystery. Occasionally we get hot and hold our own. But so often we just look slow, laborious and predictable. 

In the past, there have been Knick squads that suck because, you know, essentially their guys were better than ours. Not wildly complicated. Now it feels...different. Like we're getting much less out of this team than we should.
 
On another note, all year long I thought that our 2nd team would beat the 1st more times than not.

[chipstern]

Aside from Randle's woes, what is going on with the offense? Is it really a talent thing? For better ball clubs, it's clear about their strategies to confuse defenses, exploit weakness, so on. For us, it's a mystery. Occasionally we get hot and hold our own. But so often we just look slow, laborious and predictable. 

In the past, there have been Knick squads that suck because, you know, essentially their guys were better than ours. Not wildly complicated. Now it feels...different. Like we're getting much less out of this team than we should.
 
On another note, all year long I thought that our 2nd team would beat the 1st more times than not.

Last night in the fourth quarter, Thibs seemed to be telling them that as well.  Least ways, that they were bring
ing an energy and camraderie the first unit could not match. 

ODD

[FWK00]

In the past, there have been Knick squads that suck because, you know, essentially their guys were better than ours. Not wildly complicated. Now it feels...different. Like we're getting much less out of this team than we should.
 

This is the broader mystery.  The largely unchallenged assertion is that Thibs is a "great" coach.

But the empirical evidence suggests exactly the opposite.  How can a great coach allow Randle to play like a nightly dumpster fire?  There's zero accountability and during timeouts Randle wanders around aimlessly as if Thibs is just discussing dinner plans with the team.

And Van Gundy isn't the only one questioning the insanity of marching out the same dysfunctional unit of -cough- "starters" who don't even act as if they've met before.

What is the point of Thibs' timeouts?  Gatorade break?  The team comes out and F's up whatever was discussed.  Shouldn't a "great" coach kindof realize that nobody's paying attention?

Seems to me the gym-rat meme has played out its shelf-life and reorganizing this roster with some talent and basketball common sense might be more valuable.

[carlos123]

When I first dared, DARED, to say I did not want Thibs coaching this team any more, most here if not all, were against that notion, most eloquently Chief Chip.

I am proud to have been the first. I bet nobody here now would be terribly upset were Thibs let go. And I bet players would feel relieved and ready for a fresh start.

OFF WITH HIS HEAD ALREADY!!!

NONSENSE

OK, whatever...

Number Two, giving you the benefit of the doubt, let's assume, quite rightly, that you are not a moron

Thanks, appreciate it.

... the Knicks fired Don Nelson and replaced him with assistant Jeff Van Gundy, which worked out okay.  But then, HOWEVER, Nellie's sin, was to try and write Patrick Ewing out of the narrative.  DUH.

I actually think JVG manipulated Patrick into believing that, but that is another story. Then he got lucky in 1999, having to play Latrell and Marcus, whom he did not like, because of injuries to other players. He played favorites, some times he played them into the ground, such as he did to LJ and, to a lesser extent, to PE. He kept talking about defense, which Knicks fans rightfully love, but his offense was atrocious to nonexistent. Bad coach over all, as he proved during his time in Houston, when he did have a great team that never won anything significant with him.

Coach's ' stubborn streak and quirky rotations notwithstanding, WE HAVE A SOLID CORE OF YOUTH, and Thibs has been developing them.  Under Thibs' watch, we have seen a coming of age of Mitchell [C], Obi [PF], RJ [SF], Grimes [SG] and IQ [PG], which in case you haven't noticed, IS A TENABLE ROTATIONAL QUINTET.  And while we all lambast Thibs for sticking with his vets, when our puppies get an opportunity, Jericho and Deuce and Cam have shown solid flashes of talent and tenacity, and you better believe that they are going to get longer looks if our starting five cannot get it together.

We have indeed drafted well, but I'm not sure how much of that should be credited to Thibs, or the development of our youth. All I know is that, for the most part, he does not play them. I also know that his starting unit has disconnected from him. He has run his course here, has nothing more to offer.


MILLER TIME BABY!

[chipstern]

You speak of Mike Miller as if he were Greg Popovich or Monty Williams. 

Again, crediting your sense of humor, that is SOME WEAK CHEESE, mate. 

[carlos123]

You speak of Mike Miller as if he were Greg Popovich or Monty Williams. 

Again, crediting your sense of humor, that is SOME WEAK CHEESE, mate.

POTENTIALLY!

Glad you are coming around 😁

[facilitatorn]

You speak of Mike Miller as if he were Greg Popovich or Monty Williams. 

Again, crediting your sense of humor, that is SOME WEAK CHEESE, mate.

POTENTIALLY!

Glad you are coming around 😁

Miller had the team running sets that led to good shots.

Thibs had that to some extent last season, though some credit Woody for that.

My feeling is Thibs benched Kemba and was looking to do the same with Evan but Leon overruled him. Leon went with his free agent class over his long time client and friend. This broke Thibs authority and the organizational chain of command. The chaos that has caused will remain our hallmark until we see some personnel changes.

[carlos123]

You speak of Mike Miller as if he were Greg Popovich or Monty Williams. 

Again, crediting your sense of humor, that is SOME WEAK CHEESE, mate.

POTENTIALLY!

Glad you are coming around 😁

Miller had the team running sets that led to good shots.

Thibs had that to some extent last season, though some credit Woody for that.

My feeling is Thibs benched Kemba and was looking to do the same with Evan but Leon overruled him. Leon went with his free agent class over his long time client and friend. This broke Thibs authority and the organizational chain of command. The chaos that has caused will remain our hallmark until we see some personnel changes.

U mean this Woody?


Or this one?

[facilitatorn]

That is the guy. Contractions are such an ingrained habit

[bodiddley]

Not having a PG is killing us.

I advocated last off-season to wildly overpay FVV (having an all-star year: 22 / 7 / 5 39% on 3's, tough defense).  Knix were looking like a team on the rise, and offering the keys to FVV would have made him pause.  While TOR appeared in flux.

Or dump the wheelbarrow of cash in front of Zo Ball, who has been pretty effective on both ends for CHI.  I'd rather give those guys up to $25M  than $17M to FourEva and $8M to Kemba.  FVV signed for $20M.  BallZo took a deal starting at $19M.  Knix could have gone $22M - $25M.

I can't guarantee one of those two would have signed.  But an extra $10M - $15M over a 4 year deal is enticing.  And the Knix looked like a team on the rise.  Get to run the team in the biggest market, etc.  Both of those PG's play good ballhawking defense. and can make 3's.

Instead we left our PG slot exposed.  Walker and Rose known gimps.
Maybe we should trade Fournier for Dragic (ending deal), who might be able to turn around our season.  Okay I have no idea what is going on with the Dragon, but always liked his game.

Euro-PG's in the NBA:
1. Tony Parker
2. Goran Dragic
3. Jose Calderon
4. ?

am I forgetting someone?

[facilitatorn]

Rubio, Schroder, Shved, to name three.

Overpaying a component PG probably would have spared us the Fornier signing along with Kemba, so a net plus there even if the overpaid guy never suited up.

[bodiddley]

Best Euro-PG's in NBA history:
1. Tony Parker
2. Goran Dragic
3. Jose Calderon
4. Ricky Rubio
5. Shroder?

[bodiddley]

Rubio was my 3rd choice. 
 
Kemba and FourEva were a failed backcourt for BOS, featuring a pair of all-star level wings next to them.  Not sure why it was expected to work in NYK.  Except actually there was no PG plan. Scooping Kemba up was a late save.  Knix front office should be taken to task for the lack of a PG plan and failure to prioritize the PG slot.

So what is the timetable for Rose's return?

PS I got so bored during the MIA game, I noticed that the Knix on the court appeared virtually tattoo free except for ObiT (Grimes only seems to have acne, IQ, Burks and Taj all seemed to have refrained form inking their birthday suits).
Then I noticed MIA was pretty tat-free as well.  Butler, Bam, Duncan, Herro has a discreet Woody Woodpecker or something on one calf.  Got me wondering if tattoos are starting to fade after a 30 year run(?)  Not being in the USofA, I have no idea if that's the case.  But the NBA is often leading edge.  Maybe more hair-dying and goofy hairstyles such as RegBollix used to wear, or the strange up-'do Ja and Garland sport.  Hell, maybe my monitor is just too small to see the tattoos the players have.  Seems Rose is our illustrated man (and wears a sort of woolen winter fez these days), while ObiT and Randle have plenty.  After that, not sure the team is that inked up.  Especially the yute crew.

PPS Neck tattoos are pretty unappealing to me, especially those creepy ones of babies, such as Wil Chandler sports on his throat.  A little ghoul popping out of your shirt collar.  Yikes.

[bodiddley]

Checking out the PHI-LAL game.
StanJohn is playing super-D.
2Q, Stan is guarding Drummond down low.
Steps over to help on a Tobias drive, and is right in Harris' way as he spins and is forced into an awkward shot.

Later 2Q, Stan is guarding Embiid 1-on-1 at the FT line.
StanJohn bodies up, puts his chest into Embiid a 2nd time, and Joel gets called for an o-foul for shouldering stanJohn out of the way.
 
With LeBJ out and AD having a boo-boo, Stan seems to be the second unit center.
SJ just a thin 6'7".  But determined.  No way Lakes don't keep StanJohn for the rest of the season ... unless they're daft.

Two of Westbrook's 6 turnovers = after he rebounds the ball and is still below the FT line, throws crummy outlet passes to halfcourt, both times intercepted by Thybulle.  Jeez.  Love Thy Bull.