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Who will win Game 5 of the NBA Finals?

Warriors
- 1 (33.3%)
Celtics
- 2 (66.7%)

Total Members Voted: 3

Voting closed: June 13, 2022, 11:38:11 PM


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Author Topic: Knicks  (Read 1195334 times)

chipstern

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Prostate of the Nation
« Reply #24825 on: September 05, 2022, 02:11:46 PM »

So he can spell and instruct the aforementioned young players who we would like doing more of the things Hayward does when healthy though with more pop than we want them taking cues from or losing minutes for Obi and possibly Cam to Jules. Also Gordy will be an ending contract the year after this, the kind you move with extra draft picks and some promising young talent about to be rendered redundant for a guy who fits what you are doing and elevates those around him. This is two years ahead of the Randle timetable, even more if Oubre and Fournier become part of the deal. We may hang around, give the kids some burn letting chips fall where they may with an eye on fishing in free agency perhaps even setting markers on other teams RFAs.

Hayward is like a frontcourt Rose at this point in his career, a great player to have if you only never feel you have to give him big minutes. We have a roster where that can work out.

Minus Julius, you can spell Obi with Sims if Hartenstein is in at center.

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facilitatorn

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #24826 on: September 05, 2022, 04:37:52 PM »

So I take it you agree. Glad to see you have come around, Chip.

I do not think it is happening. I expect Julius will be with us when we start the season. Hopefully Brunson can both unlock him and curb his worst impulses.
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chipstern

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Au Contraire
« Reply #24827 on: September 05, 2022, 05:36:05 PM »

So I take it you agree. Glad to see you have come around, Chip.

I do not think it is happening. I expect Julius will be with us when we start the season. Hopefully Brunson can both unlock him and curb his worst impulses.

Uh...no...I love your perspective, but I grow weary of all of these OPENS UP CAP SPACE PHANTASIAS.  And Hayward?  Oubre?  In place of Julius?  Evan?  Not doing the Hornets any favors.  No thanks. 

Given my druthers, and I like Fournier, I would like to see Leon explore moving him to open up time for Grimes, Reddish and IQ. 

Julius?

Needs to improve his offensive efficiency and defense, make more decisive decisions with the ball. Way less pounding the rock, more motion and movement off the ball. 

Could say the same about R.J. for that matter. 

Clearly, JR is on the clock.  He needs to get his mojo back, evolve his team game. 

To the degree that Jalen Brunson can function as Thibs' coach on the floor, we might see a significant boiunce back from JR, and big steps forward for RJ, Grimes and Mitchell. 

To the degree that Jalen Brunson bonds with Thibs, we might see a significant offensive evolution. 

PS: Been suggested that Ainge did not negotiate in good faith, and did not want to see Mitchell on the Knicks.  Interesting. 
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facilitatorn

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #24828 on: September 05, 2022, 06:41:54 PM »

I am still trying to figure out witch of Mitchell and Garland will check Middleton, Lavine, Cade, Harden, or Brown. It probably will not be much of a problem.

If Brunsoncan get Jules to play toward team needs we will be pretty good. If Jules can get Jules to play that way, same thing. It is a outcome few expect to work out.
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chipstern

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #24829 on: September 05, 2022, 09:04:34 PM »

I am still trying to figure out witch of Mitchell and Garland will check Middleton, Lavine, Cade, Harden, or Brown. It probably will not be much of a problem.

If Brunsoncan get Jules to play toward team needs we will be pretty good. If Jules can get Jules to play that way, same thing. It is a outcome few expect to work out.

So now who's a Negative Nancy? 
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facilitatorn

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #24830 on: September 05, 2022, 09:20:41 PM »

I think we are a strong team with a highly talented, highly paid time bomb on the squad.

Is it something we can make work?

Is it something we need to address?
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chipstern

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The Big Question
« Reply #24831 on: September 05, 2022, 11:50:05 PM »

I think we are a strong team with a highly talented, highly paid time bomb on the squad.

Is it something we can make work?

Is it something we need to address?

The Knicks have a BIG THREE

RJ
Jalen
Julius


And a lot of talented complementary pieces, looking to step up to the next level, individually, and collectively. 

However, it is not enough to BE the best player, you have to CARRY yourself like a LEADER. 

And this being NEW YORK, you have to be PERCEIVED to BE a LEADER. 

I think questions about Julius are legit. 

We know he WANTS to be a Knick.  He gave the team a hometown price on his extension. 

A TICKING TIME BOMB?

While there are questions and concerns JR must address moving forward, I think that for the fans to write him off as a ticking time bomb is...hysterical. 

Certainly, while he ALWAYS competed last season, we know that Julius has a tendency to get in his own head and over think things, and his response to adversity, and frustration WITH HIMSELF and HIS PERFORMANCE, manifefsted itself in PROJECTIONS that...

Well, let's put it this way. 

PROJECTIONS....



The great Count Basie tenor saxophone innovator LESTER YOUNG, was once talking to a friend about a mutual aquaintance who was going through some frustrating changes. 

"You'll be with a cat who's cursing you out, and you think it has something to do with you, but he's actually calling himself a motherfucker, and you just happen to be in the same room."

Julius' "responses" came out bASSackWARDS.  He was cussing himself out, and it came out WRONG. 

Look, Julius is not a useless sack of shit like Joakim Noah, who basically laid down after getting a big contract from Phool Jagoff, not in shape, no dedication to the team.  He bagged it, and seemingly didn't give a fuck.

JULIUS GIVES TOO MANY FUCKS.   

Hey, look at the difference a season or two, hell a summer can make in terms of giving someone perspective. 

Derrick Rose was kind of a moody, petulant dick his first season as a Knick under Phool & Company.  He wasn't a ticking time bomb, but he was kind of in his own private Idaho on his first MSG go round. 

LOOK HOW HE RESPONDED WHEN HE CAME BACK FOR ANOTHER TRY.  A WHOLE DIFFERENT ATTITUDE. 

Last season Julius was tasked with a burden he was not up to, and he often faltered.  Not every game, but he lacked consistency and seemingly focus. 

Some of that is on him.  Some of that is on Thibs.  Some of that is on Leon and management.  Not having a point guard just exploded in our faces. 

DOES IT NEED TO ADDRESSED? 

How.  By a public shaming.  By shipping him out of town on a Chinese Garbage Trawler in giveaway deals for pennies on the dollar?  In the name of cap space, getting back bupkus in return. 

Julius has a nice contract. He made a commitment to the Knicks, and they in turn made one back to him.

No one ever accused him of not putting the work in. 

Julius is not a problem that needs to addressed. 

He is a talented player who NEEDED HELP and was tasked with too much responsibility.  Exchanging Payton and Bullock for Walker and Fournier was glitchy.  Losing THEO PINSON, of all people, had a weird ripple effect in the locker room, the practice facility and on the floor.  You can see what his presence did for the Mavs.

We cashiered our vets Walker, Burks, Noel and Gibson for cap space and to open up space for our puppies to grow. 

Obviously Taj was not a problem, Burks was a gamer and Noel was gimpy.  Obviously Walker was a disaster AND WE DEALT WITH IT. 

Getting Brunson and Hartenstein addressed some serious roster issues. 

HOW WILL JULIUS DEAL WITH IT, seems to be your overriding concern. 

PS: Well, RJ is now THE MAN, JB is the rudder and floor general, and JR is the bell cow.  How will they cohere?
Look, I've pointed his out before, but it bears repeating.  The very minute the season ended, Obi reached out to JR in a very solicitous manner, and spoke of working out with him, and the potential of them being on the floor together in 2022-23.  To me, that is significant.  Obi did not view JR as a roadblock, and impediment, but as a BROTHER.  They are putting in time and WORK individually and as team mates.  I was encouraged to see Jalen, Obi and JR team up this summer for a playground tournament game.  Building trust.  Building chemistry. 

If something is GOING TO BE DEALT with, dumping someone for pennies on the dollar in some putative adition by subtraction scenarios is supercillious to me.  What might make sense on paper, is going to disrupt chemistry in the gym.  Mitchell, Julius, JR, Obi, IQ, Grimes, McBride, Cam, Evan and Jericho have bonds of experience they shared, collective ups and down, winning and losing, baby steps and giant steps THEY SHARED last season, and you don't tear that asunder, change for change's sake. 

You saw that the Knicks were willing to approach and explore deals, hell, Mitchell and RJ were both in play at differnt points in the Donovan Mitchell Dance, but ultimately the Knicks proved unwilling to strip mine their roster, change for change's sake. 

If you are going to ponder offloading anyone, makes sense to BUILD UP THEIR VALUE for any plausible transactions, let them revisit the bonds of last season on the practice court, competing and building skill and collective trust in preseason. 

Hey, we were apparently willing to include RJ, our lead dawg, in a trade, so no one is untouchable.  Including JR. 

To me he has earned the right to prove his Knickdom, and reboot his game with a young squad an ascendant pup in RJ and a tough, scrappy little bulldog of a new PG, and if "the fans" are crying OFF WITH HIS HEAD, well, you already know what I think of THAT. 
« Last Edit: September 05, 2022, 11:56:28 PM by chipstern »
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facilitatorn

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #24832 on: September 06, 2022, 01:36:10 AM »

If we are locked in to RJ Jalen and Julius, which we probably are, I want to put them with Hartenstein and Grimes to add floor spacing, a little playmaking, and defensive acumen to a group that is physically solid but plodding by the NBA standards of today. I can see that becoming the closing unit even if the group never starts.

To be honest I like every unit a little better with Obi than with Julius.

These are good problems for a team to have so long as everyone can keep their heads as their minutes fluctuate.
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kidcarter8

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #24833 on: September 06, 2022, 11:00:39 AM »

Minutes watch on Obi is 22.  On Grimes is 20.
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Kam

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #24834 on: September 06, 2022, 12:34:05 PM »

With all due respect, we have a small three.  Not a BIG three.

RJ - still unproven
JB - small sample size
JR - one good year

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chipstern

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #24835 on: September 06, 2022, 01:03:13 PM »

With all due respect, we have a small three.  Not a BIG three.

RJ - still unproven
JB - small sample size
JR - one good year

No love for Kam Reddish?
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kidcarter8

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #24836 on: September 06, 2022, 03:48:36 PM »

JR - one good year



Come onnnn, man.
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kidcarter8

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #24837 on: September 06, 2022, 03:54:33 PM »

Of Julius's top 4 PER seasons 2 of them were with NYK.


Th 3rd - and the 4th highest
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kidcarter8

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Re: Knicks
« Reply #24838 on: September 06, 2022, 03:58:38 PM »

Meanwhile MITCHELL ROBINSON is truly underrated.
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chipstern

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Julius
« Reply #24839 on: September 06, 2022, 06:40:06 PM »

A team sport last time I checked.

Julius not operating in a vacuum.
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